This is how you silence people. Facts and logic.

No need to ban anyone when you can prove you are right.

This was a good exchange.

I seriously don't even know where you are going with this. You are trying so hard to be right about something. I don't wish to discuss vaccines and science with you. We were discussing misinformation; the example I used to show how the words misinformation and disinformation are used to suppress speech just happened to be about the vaccines. Stay on topic.

Yes, in the history of the world there have been scientific discoveries that have changed scientific definitions. You are correct! Usually they don't happen in the course of 6 months and usually they don't involve the government forcing the population to take a drug, but in the history of science it has happened. Isn't it cool how I can directly address your statement?

Now, back to the topic that you so greatly want to avoid. I want an example on THIS:

Misinformation and Disinformation are bullshit words used only to suppress speech.

There is no example of actual misinformation that I can't call a lie.

Dumbfuck, huh? I'm absolutely kicking your ass on an intellectual level. You've got NOTHING for me.

You aren't able to provide a single example to support your stance. Not one. As a matter of fact, you haven't even addressed a single point I've made. You just make excuse after excuse.

"Yeah, but at that time, to the best of our knowledge, blah blah"

I have dismantled your argument over and over and over. You're so beaten on the topic of mis and disinformation that you've moved on now.

And no, we don't need an asterisk on every statement ever made. I understand you are feeling embarrassed and are now lashing out and calling names but this is just a dumb thing to say even when you are mad. If, however, something is presented as a medical fact and there is even an infinitesimal chance that it is wrong, yeah, I think it should include a disclaimer. Every FDA approved medicine has a ton of them.

If something is KNOWN then it doesn't change. Otherwise it isn't KNOWN, it is assumed.

There is a thing (used to be anyway) called Scientific Theory. Science, not The Science, just regular old Science. It involves three steps: Testable, Replicable, Stable. What you don't see there is "At one time it was believed...".

Regardless, none of this has anything to do with these two bullshit words being used to suppress speech.

Over on r/News, this is the first comment on a post (by a very objective mod /s):

"Antivaxxers are not welcome in r/news.
If you are spouting misinformation about COVID-19, vaccines, or even
just general antivax talking points, you will be permanently banned.
Consider this your warning."

Do you know why that says "If you are spouting misinformation" rather than "If you are spouting lies"? It is because they can call whatever they want misinformation without having to prove anything.

If it said "Lies", then a banned user would be able to say "Please show me how I'm lying". This requires proof.

Since it says "Misinformation", a banned used must say "Please show me how I'm wrong" and Mod can say "I'M NOT DOING THIS WITH YOU FASCIST" and move on. No proof required. Your thoughts are bad and we will not let you share them.

That's why you are unable to find any example of misinformation to which I can't respond with "That is a lie".

Misinformation and Disinformation are words only used to suppress speech.

Oh my! How dare us call politicians liars when they lie! How about they have an idea of what they are talking about before presenting something as fact? Or, there is the option of saying "We aren't sure, but we're hoping that...". Nah, let's present it as fact and shut down any conversation.

Knowledge and Facts are not the same thing. Did I reference knowledge anywhere? I refer to FACTS. Facts are static, unchanging things. If they weren't they wouldn't be called Facts.

Back on point... Misinformation and Disinformation are bullshit words only used to suppress speech. You asked how, I just showed you how.

You're dug in and that's okay with me. I've proven my point over and over. I've answered your questions with yes and no and given examples.

There isn't one single example of actual mis(or dis)information that I can't call a lie.

Misinformation is used in place of lies because it muddles the definition of a lie and causes a grey area. There is no grey area when it comes to the truth or a lie.

Misinformation is used to suppress speech in this manner. I'm only using this example because it is recent, big, and accurate.

"If you get vaccinated, you can't spread the virus" This was presented as fact, while in reality it was a lie. Anything questioning this lie was classified as "misinformation" and was removed from message boards, social media, etc. We weren't even allowed to ask the question. This suppressed speech.

"If you get vaccinated, you can still spread the virus" - this fact was called misinformation. No one ever said "That is a lie". Why, because it isn't a lie and calling it a lie would come back and bite you on the ass. You can talk your way out of "misinformation" - once you call someone a liar you have liability.

Misinformation... not a lie, but we don't want you talking about it so we're not going to let you. I can't really prove you wrong so I'm just going to shut it down.

Lie... say whatever you want. I'll prove you a liar and show the world.

If you could find an example that proved your point you would find time. The reason you don't have time is because it is impossible.

I'll help using the specific examples in this article:

"These ads contained falsehoods such as telling voters they needed to be vaccinated to vote in person" Not mis or disinformation, this is a lie.

"that voters would need to vote twice so that their votes would count" Not mis or disinformation, this is a lie.

Misinformation and Disinformation are used to suppress speech. That is it. There is nuance in language, I agree. There is no nuance to the truth.

Thank you.

These are propaganda words and anyone with a lick of sense can see right through them. They can't be explained or defended.

I see that you are unable to provide one single example of "misinformation" that I can't call a lie.

Facts do not require nuance.

This is what happens every single time I have this conversation.

Thank you for helping me prove my point.

1. It isn't what "I call" a lie. It is a lie. Let's try not to make this personal.
2. Can you provide an example? I believe I will be able to respond with either "That is the truth" or "That is a lie".

I'll use your exact words in a different order:

Actually, disinformation is what you would call a "lie". Misinformation is inaccurate information formed through some other
means. By error of some kind, or misunderstanding. It's disinformation
without the malicious intent. Otherwise, not

Disinformation is a lie.

Misinformation is disinformation without the malicious intent.

Misinformation is a lie.

I do. Show me an example of mis or disinformation that I can’t call a lie. I’ll show you how those words work.

Okay, and both are bullshit.

I honestly have no response to someone that says they wouldn’t call accurate information the truth.

Yes, when it involves science or politics. I prefer facts.

The is no such thing as misinformation. There is the truth, and there are lies.

Misinformation and disinformation are bullshit words. If lies are being spread, say it.