>The grid as it exists today has taken into account running them both simultaneously.

The grid doesn't directly care how efficient something is. It only cares about how much power is being drawn. A central AC is roughly 3 to 5kW. A dryer is roughly 2 to 5kW. That's 5 to 10 kW, and a level 2 EV is right in the middle of that range. So, by your statement, "the grid" can handle EV's charging at night, since it can already handle AC+dryer during the day.

>Programming vehicles to charge between any times doesn't guarantee that it will always be so, again what you are describing is an ideal situation. Even with programming you cannot guarantee that the day wont ever come that people wont charge their vehicles during peak hours. This is not due to stupidity, maliciousness, arrogance, or anything of the sort. It may come in the form of an emergency where people may have to evacuate, or other unprecedented scenarios. Think about it like this if there is ever a situation where you think you might lose power are you really going to wait to charge your vehicle?

Of course it's no guarantee, but money is a powerful motivator. Yes, we have accidentally charged our car during mid-peak hours, which costs me not quite double what off-peak costs. Of course mistakes like that will happen, but so what? Every EV owner is not going to make this same mistake at the same time. You keep insisting that the grid needs to plan for this extremist nonsense. And I say, no, it doesn't. That would be throwing tons of infrastructure money away, overdesigning for a theoretical edge case with a likeliness of occurrence so low that it may as well be zero. That is not how you do capacity design.

As for emergencies...so what? If I lose power, guess what? The battery in my car still holds its charge. And unlike an ICE vehicle, it doesn't consume a significant amount power while idling in traffic (an ICE engine burns roughly 1/4 to 1/2 gallon per hour while idling). Remember that big snowstorm in the NE? EV's, it turns out, did just fine. More than fine.

If a storm is coming, maybe I'll charge to 80% even if I'm not down very much. So what? That's going to be a really short charging session. Or, if I am especially worried, maybe I'll take the extra hour and go to 90% so give me more usable miles. Most ICE car owners will also gas up to a full tank, too. It's the same strategy, only I don't have to wait in line to do it.

If it's a sudden disaster, like an earthquake? The car is the last thing I am worried about.

You're way too lost in whataboutism.

>far as trusting you goes I'm having a hard time doing so (I'm not sure if you truly meant kW or kWh two different things one is power the other is energy you consume energy and power is the rate in which you consume that energy it seems they may have gotten mixed up)

The "7 to 8 kWh" figure I used for Level 2 charger, stating kWh instead of kW, was a simple typo. I know those are unusual on the internet, but there you go.

>If any of it gives you FUD that's because life is that way there are many things we don't know such as how the future will play out, there is a lot of uncertainty in reality, and doubt is something we all deal with everyday. Ignoring the facts doesn't make any of that go away.

It's FUD because it's based on hypotheticals and extreme cases. Read that third article you linked to, again. The grid is able to handle current adoption rates. There is plenty of time to plan for years from now, when adoption rates will be forced to accelerate further. Money has been allocated for exactly that purpose.

>How many people run multiple dryers at home? How many people have multiple cars at home?

I have run my AC and my dryer at the same time.

>How you will you guarantee cars will only be charged between 9pm and 6am?

You program them not to run between 5pm and 9pm, or whenever your peak hours are.

Trust me on this: when you get an EV, you become very aware of how much electricity costs. If you want to pay a lot less for charging than you do for the equivalent mileage from gas, then you move to a plan where you pay based on the time of day. In this case, capitalism and the market work in your favor. Few things build habits quite like cost of use.

You keep talking about the grid as if adding overnight charging is some huge stress. It's not. Even the third article you linked to say this. (The fourth was behind a pay wall so I couldn't read it).

The average home uses about 30kW of electricity per day. That usage is concentrated between 6 or 7am and 9 or 10pm. A level 2 charger is about 7 to 8 kWh, and my charger's stats tell me my longest sessions are about 5 hours, for a total of 34kW, but more typical is a 3.5 hour charge because we prefer to keep the battery above 40% (trading a little long-term lifetime to ensure we have plenty of range during an emergency). But I am not charging every day: I am charging maybe 2x a week at most. So twice a week I am pulling up to 8 kW an hour for a few hours, when the only other things of note running in the house are the fridge, water heater, and HVAC.

When the second car arrives, my best option is really to stagger. Most folks probably only have one level 2 charger, so they have to stagger anyway. There may be some cases where both cars are charging at the same time, but since you don't need to charge every day, that's just not going to happen frequently.

All this stuff you write is mostly FUD. It's human nature to joke around and say that people are stupid, but they really aren't. People learn the things they need to learn.

Stop assuming that everyone is going to charge their cars all at once. Stop assuming that everyone will collectively lose their minds and charge during the day when electricity is the most expensive. Why would you assume these things? The first article you linked to makes this same assumption and it's just plain silly.

>To the best of your knowledge what is the worst case scenario for charging EVs?

Rapid charging during the daytime. It is expensive and requires a large amount of power. Busy charging stations are in constant use, so that power demand is significant. But the only people who should be rapid charging are those who are on a long road trip, where time matters.

>but rather in as we move to more EVs at home the current infrastructure of the grid is not equipped to deal with the new demands.

People run clothes dryers at home today, and they often do it at peak times because that's when they are awake and able to do laundry. They also run their AC during peak hours, which is also during the hottest part of the day.

EV charging happens at night, between 9pm and 6am, when nothing else is going on in the house, when residential energy demand is at its lowest. And it's the same power draw as these huge appliances.

So in 10 years, you have more people effectively running their dryer at night. If everyone running their AC at the same time during peak hours isn't a constant problem in the summer (yes, it occasionally is, but they key word there is occasionally), why do you think level 2 charging in the middle of the night is going to be an issue?

The real problem is people who don't have access to at-home charging. They are at risk of having to charge in suboptimal conditions, and at suboptimal times. And yes, that is going to be a problem in 10 years unless we do something about it, because it is a problem right now.

Edge cases affect ICE cars as well. Long lines at gas pumps are a regular thing after major hurricanes, for example. As for the future...

>For example will it always be the case everyone charges at night?

People will charge their cars at the intersection of "cheapest electricity" and "where the car is located". That means the majority of charging will continue to happen:

1. at night at home (since we are generally all home at night, and electricity is cheapest then), and
2. at work, in situations where the employer offers at-cost charging or close to it (commercial electricity rates tend to be a lot cheaper than residential)

>What happens during a particularly cold winter, or extremely hot summer

You're asking the wrong questions. The more important question is, "what about people who can't park their car in a garage"? Those are the folks without easy access to low-cost charging, or an enclosed parking space that mitigates temperature extremes on their EV battery. That's a problem that we don't even need 10 years to get to.

I know exactly how power hungry it is. Yet we have been powering them at home for decades.

But 8 hours a day or more of charging? Where are you getting your math from? Or what are you smoking so I can have some? According to my charger stats, I charge roughly twice a week for maybe 4 hours at most each session. That's less than 8 hours a week.

8 hours of charging nets me about 200 miles of range. Who regularly drives 200 miles a day? I am sure someone does, but they aren't the average car owner by any stretch.

Facts are great for that. Suggest you try them.

This is why Twitter is so important.

Elon Musk is going to solve that one right after he fixes Twitter.

Even a power plant running on fossil fuel is more efficient than your car's engine.

Where exactly do you need to go during a blackout?

Also, pretty sure my EV battery holds its charge during a blackout.

Most home EV charging happens at night when there is virtually no other residential demand for power. And it is on par with running your dryer.

My level 2 charger uses as much energy as my clothes dryer. Better stop building new dryers?

Good thing that fossil fuels will never run out, then.