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mtaw t1_j6f3ycv wrote

Reply to comment by [deleted] in Ukraine proposes creating mechanism for auditing US aid for recovery projects by progress18

Foreign aid almost ass a rule goes to countries that are very corrupt, and national aid organizations have long since worked out ways to minimize the opportunities for and risks of corruption, ensure accountability and so on.

This is just a belt-and-suspenders move to sway domestic opinion in donor countries for the ignorant masses who never spent a second thinking about how foreign aid works and are therefore easily swayed by people saying "it's a corrupt country, you can't give them money!", as if aid organizations just hand out money blindly, when the reality is they've got decades of experience dealing with those issues. Nobody wants to see their foreign aid money wasted.

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AntiworkDPT-OCS t1_j6fky7q wrote

You are correct. I'm in the middle of a masters program on this. A TON of academic thought has gone into aid to corrupt countries. It's generally not famine, disease, or war that kills a country, it's corruption. And those with the money know this.

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lil_sh_t t1_j6fmqi6 wrote

Maybe Ukraine will be somewhat unique.

It only makes sense for them to swiftly and quickly join Western 'parties' ASAP. I used parties instead of alliances, unions or anything, because those terms are heavily associated with NATO and the EU. Even if these are the final goals, Ukraine would currently be happy to be invited to whatever increases ties to the West. Be it Baltic Union, Scandinavia or the European Ping-Pong association.

Jokes aside, maximum accountability, transparency, competence and zeal are required and Ukraine seems on the path to all of them. Alas they drag their feet and another unfortunate happening occurs.

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flight_recorder t1_j6fpeuk wrote

How does the scale at which this aid could be implemented change things? Like, I imagine Ukraine will need a LOT of aid to rebuild, and relatively fast. Are these aid organizations equipped to account for that much money that quickly?

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AntiworkDPT-OCS t1_j6gjmj0 wrote

It's through a U.S. military college so I am mostly familiar with U.S. capacities. So yes, the U.S. can do it, but I'm not much up on NGOs and other governments.

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Nakagawa-7 t1_j6g3af2 wrote

Normally I’d be on your side. But I have to point out, for Americans at least, after 20 years of Afghanistan, being suspicious of corruption risks in giving aid is a very very well founded concern.

Because if all these orgs had mechanisms to prevent corruption lmfao, buddy, nobody told that to the afghans, not to mention the US politicians and businessmen who figured out how to discretely take advantage for their own benefits.

But I’m just saying that experience is hard to forget. Ukraine isn’t Afghanistan, luckily no other country is quite like that place. Ukraine is fully worth trying to help until the unlikely chance they prove otherwise.

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qainin t1_j6fdkjj wrote

The main bulk of the money for reconstruction will come from Russia.

The bill will end out in Moscow.

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lil_sh_t t1_j6fn0zx wrote

Like billing a bum

Can't force money out of an empty plate. Especially if that plate will only retain meagre rations in the future too.

Demographics and technology are screwed for years. The former even for decades.

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circ_le_jerk_69 t1_j6fzto3 wrote

The West has frozen something like $300 billion of Russian central bank assets. That might not be enough to cover reconstruction, but it's a good start. All that's needed is a mechanism to transfer that money to Ukraine (e.g. Ukraine sues Russia in some international court).

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Nakagawa-7 t1_j6g58om wrote

Pretty sure they already know that won’t be enough, like with what’s being expended on the war already. Ukraine has virtually no economy until the war ends, and that’d be devastatingly expensive for an entire country even not fighting a war.

But I also want to point out, lumping all the cost on Russia might be another treaty of Versailles style mistake. Any Russian not yet born or old enough to be involved right now, doesn’t bear responsibility and shouldn’t be made to. They don’t need actual legit grievances to want revenge against the west for.

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circ_le_jerk_69 t1_j6gimnj wrote

We don't have the ability to lump all the costs on Russia because they have nukes, unlike Germany in 1919. We do have the ability to have them contribute $300 billion though. Like you said, that won't be enough. Ukraine and their backers will have to cover the rest.

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