Viewing a single comment thread. View all comments

[deleted] t1_j2culcu wrote

[deleted]

112

NeurodiverseTurtle t1_j2daha3 wrote

Can some kind soul fill me in? I’m at work and can’t spend time googling if this is interesting or not.

(I like to stay up to date, but I usually ignore Turkish news because their president indulges Putin too often. Can’t help but see Erdogan and Orban as traitors to the free world—can’t play both sides in this war lads, Russia are the new Nazis)

9

Pls-No-Bully t1_j2dd18z wrote

>(I like to stay up to date, but I usually ignore Turkish news because their president indulges Putin too often. Can’t help but see Erdogan and Orban as traitors to the free world—can’t play both sides in this war, Russia are the new Nazis)

You do know that the Grey Wolves were created by NATO as part of Operation Gladio, right?

They funded, trained, and coordinated with Alparslan Türkeş, a far-right Turkish politician, as part of [Counter-Guerrilla](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Counter-Guerrilla#Tactical_Mobilization_Group_(1952%E2%80%931965)). Türkeş then created the Nationalist Movement Party and its militant youth wing, the Grey Wolves.

> The CIA employed people from the far right, such as Pan-Turkist SS-member Ruzi Nazar (father of Sylvia Nasar),[17] to train the Grey Wolves ^[[Source]](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Counter-Guerrilla#Tactical_Mobilization_Group_(1952%E2%80%931965))

The Grey Wolves are actually enemies of Erdogan, Russia, China, and even the PKK (considering the PKK's communist roots).

Say what you want about Putin, Erdogan, etc., I'm certainly not defending them, but this Turkish Nazi-equivalent was literally created by NATO.

9

NeurodiverseTurtle t1_j2dn0rl wrote

I didn’t even mention NATO, but thanks for the info. I won’t check if it’s legit or not though, because by that logic you could argue that the US ‘created’ Osama Bin Laden… which gets said a lot, but is actually an absurdity, considering you can’t possibly predict the free will of quite literally anyone.

To me it kinda sounds like you’ve just got an agenda against NATO. Which is fine, you-do-you bro.

But NATO requires cooperation between all member states, so I find it unlikely that blame could be placed solely on what is effectively just a defensive alliance, and not some kind of shady world-govt…

34

amckaazli t1_j2drpmn wrote

Spot on.

Gladio organizations such as Grey Wolves popped in virtually all NATO countries under threat of Soviet influence during the Cold War, not just Turkey.

However it was Turkey's decision not to disband them once the Cold War ended and use them against the Kurdish insurgency. Grey Wolves haven't been under NATO/CIA influence for more than 30 years now. It has become its own thing and rebranded itself as the youth wing of MHP (ultranationalists) to legitimize its existence. Claiming NATO has anything to do with Grey Wolves as it exists today is completely baseless (and I really don't see the point in pushing such an agenda?).

18

ZrvaDetector t1_j2e2k6a wrote

They stopped being a militant group after the Cold War. If Kurdish parties like HDP which blatantly support PKK are accepted into the parliment, why wouldn't the nationalists be accepted?

−2

amckaazli t1_j2ec4w2 wrote

They haven't stopped being a militant group- after the 80s they started receiving direct state support and the state started filling up Turkish military ranks with Grey Wolves affiliates. Groups such as JITEM and others were directly associated with Grey Wolves and were heavily utilized against Kurdish insurgents and leftists alike, basically working as state assassins under protection of the military.

7

ZrvaDetector t1_j2ednxc wrote

Existance of JITEM ended a few years after the Cold War. This stuff happened in the 90's.

6

amckaazli t1_j2emctj wrote

JITEM was said to be active as late as late 90s. Grey Wolves affiliated organizations are still active as of today within police and military ranks (JOH and POH).

2

notehp t1_j2dszrn wrote

> I won’t check if it’s legit or not though, because by that logic you could argue that the US ‘created’ Osama Bin Laden…

How does that even remotely compare? CIA together with other Western intelligence agencies recruited specifically far-right (including literal Nazis) paramilitary groups in numerous countries, which were then integrated into NATO, in order to have local resistance in case of a Soviet attack. The US didn't recruit bin Laden to be a terrorist, but the US actually did recruited these paramilitary groups to be exactly far-right militants and terrorists. In some countries investigations have brought to light that the CIA has indeed at times encouraged these paramilitary groups to commit false flag acts of violence and terror in order to turn public opinion against the left or prepare to commit terrorist attacks in case left-wing parties win elections (examples: Italy, Switzerland).

Claiming this can be interpreted less nefarious and is up to whatever your point of view is, is simply burying your head in the sand.

0

jiminthenorth t1_j2du4mf wrote

I went to his house in Nicosia, having no idea who he was at the time.

"There's a lot of wolf-based iconography about" I said at the time.

I felt rather silly when I found out who's house I'd been in.

5

GreatMidnight t1_j2dv4uf wrote

Was it on airbnb? How did you end up there?

3

jiminthenorth t1_j2e0k79 wrote

No, it's a museum these days. Was doing some touristing. The restaurant in the Buyuk Han, not too far away, is excellent, I might add.

3