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Gitzser t1_ja76ise wrote

if you ignore all the experts in this post you'll see its a good thing.

communication is vital

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ThrowawayBone333 t1_jabr55g wrote

Their religion tells them to kill.

You have to convince people that love is better than religion by donating them food and infrastructure.

Their leaders won't be able to warmonger anymore once they no longer depend on them.

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autotldr t1_ja3w128 wrote

This is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 91%. (I'm a bot)

> JERUSALEM - The Jordanian government on Sunday announced that Israel and the Palestinians had agreed to de-escalate tensions, shortly after a Palestinian gunman killed two Israelis in a shooting in the occupied West Bank.

> Sunday's shooting marked the latest violence in a wave of fighting that has killed dozens of Israelis and Palestinians over the past year.

> Violence between Israelis and Palestinians has surged since Israel stepped up raids across the West Bank following a spate of Palestinian attacks last spring.

Extended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Palestinian^#1 Israel^#2 Israeli^#3 Bank^#4 West^#5

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myebubbles t1_ja7h0ps wrote

You know there's a coordinated effort on Reddit when.... :

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2-Legit-2-Quip t1_ja9ec2h wrote

Occupying, stealing homes, and forcing people into ghettos is fine as long as the ones doing it are...

−3

Cionite t1_ja684v5 wrote

Hahahahahahahaha!

−9

Killerusernamebro t1_ja5k7gs wrote

Omg. Fuck both of these groups of morons. Been doing this for how long? Still haven't stopped? I'm so done. Let the desert consume both of these miserable peoples.

−35

Ok-disaster2022 t1_ja45dni wrote

The best way is to get all the old guys out of power on power sides. The younger generations just want peace and are tired of conflict. Young leaders are the best hope for peace before they get indoctrinated into ongoing meaningless death and destruction. There's clear patterns of escalations and tensions everytime there's an election coming up or political disunity.

−37

thatsnotwait t1_ja47a4o wrote

The old guys on Israel keep winning elections. The majority of Israelis don't want peace (more specifically, they don't want to make the concessions required for Palestinians to accept peace).

−53

onlyfacts2000 t1_ja4ayk5 wrote

Israel has already made any concession that makes sense, including 5 different offers of sovereignty to the Palestinians. All refused in favor of violence.

The fact that redditors have an extremely short memory and are ignorant on the issue, does not mean Israelis forget this senseless and endless violence.

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thatsnotwait t1_ja4c3g7 wrote

They're being refused by what is essentially a dictatorship, and none of the offers were particularly fair to begin with.

But yeah part of the issue is that there is no offer that "makes sense" to both sides. It doesn't make sense to Israel to vacate settlements they annexed decades ago, and it doesn't make sense for Palestine to become the only country since WW2 that accepts the legitimacy of losing territory by military conquest.

−34

onlyfacts2000 t1_ja4czon wrote

> They're being refused by what is essentially a dictatorship, and none of the offers were particularly fair to begin with.

What dictatorship? I don't follow. Also the offers were extremely fair. The last one Olmert made was so good I doubt they will ever get anything even close to it.

Very stupid of their leaders, but you can always count on the Palestinian leaders to fuck up their people ever since the 30s.

> But yeah part of the issue is that there is no offer that "makes sense" to both sides. It doesn't make sense to Israel to vacate settlements they annexed decades ago, and it doesn't make sense for Palestine to become the only country since WW2 that accepts the legitimacy of losing territory by military conquest.

Israel has already agreed to dismantling settlements historically, as it actually did in the Gaza strip (And only got tens of thousands of rockets in return) and as it offered to do in many of the suggestions to the Palestinians. Again, your comment is factually not true.

Regarding the Palestinians losing territory: Hey buddy, you declare a genocidal total war attempting to (Actual quote) "Annihilate" the other side? Better be prepared for a total lose as well.

The Palestinians are extremely lucky that Israel is not even 1% as cruel as their leaders, or there would be exactly 0 Palestinians in the WB and Gaza ever since 67.

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[deleted] t1_ja4vcms wrote

[removed]

−13

onlyfacts2000 t1_ja4vt57 wrote

Yes, there are. You try and declare your intentions to murder someone and engage in an armed conflict with him, you lose, you are lucky to be alive. It's not that hard logic to follow.

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LargeSubject8 t1_ja4wsp9 wrote

You’re talking about wiping an entire people off the planet. There is no excuse or justification for that.

−22

onlyfacts2000 t1_ja4xee3 wrote

............... 🤦‍♂️

"Wiping entire people off the planet" Was factually the Palestinian leaders goal, still is by the way.

I said, that Israel is clearly not interested in such barbaric things, as it factually could do it military wise.

Are you even paying attention? Or just looking for reasons to hate me?

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[deleted] t1_ja4ymhr wrote

[removed]

−11

yaniv297 t1_ja5evcq wrote

You know if Israel actually wanted to annhalite Palestinians, they could have done it in about an hour, right?

That guy you're talking with is absolutely right, Israel were far from perfect at times but they were never ever genocidal. While a genocide is the stated intention of Palestinian leadership even today.

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yaniv297 t1_ja5hg0h wrote

> it doesn't make sense for Palestine to become the only country since WW2 that accepts the legitimacy of losing territory by military conquest.

First of all, Palestinians never had a country or official territory to begin with. Some of the Israeli offers were very fair in the circumstances.

You say it "doesn't make sense" to accept the loss - why? What's the alternative, what's the Palestinian end game, to win the war and conquer Israel? Israel have one of the world's best and most modern armies, state of art intelligence that knows everything in Gaza strip, a top class airforce, the Mossad, Shin Bet, etc. Plus Israel have the USA on its side, and they have nukes.

So option one: keep fighting this truly hopeless fight hoping for some miraclous win, while living in povetry and hundreds of innocents on both sides die.

Option two - accept defeat and a peace deal, build a country that's smaller than you wanted. The world will celebrate this unlikely peace - A truly peaceful Palestinian country will be immediately beloved worldwide and will be showered with donations. Palestinians have often worked in Israel and with Israelis. Over time, if true peace holds, the new country can benefit greatly from Israel's riches, jobs and technologies.

But according to you, option two "doesn't make sense", because, well... Why?

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Ahneg t1_ja64omf wrote

Offering up nothing more then my personal opinion here I believe that if the Palestinians choose peace and play their cards right they could be enormously economically successful. I’ve never been but from what I hear about Gaza and their climate and beaches the place could be another Monte Carlo, and the religious tourism in the West Bank would be off the charts, if people felt safe.

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yaniv297 t1_ja6ywky wrote

Yeah well, the Tel Aviv beaches are gorgeous and the Gaza coastline is the continuation of them. With all the "publicity" of the conflict, a peaceful solution would be historic world news and will cause a huge financial bloom. There's so much potential to make Gaza truly a beautiful thing. Sadly, the population there is not very educated (lack universities, etc), but this can change with times.

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dmastra97 t1_ja7ds7y wrote

I guess you have to put yourselves in their shoes. If part of your country was taken over would you just accept it?

−3

TwitchyJC t1_ja4aaju wrote

I can't even take this seriously. The Palestinians could have had the majority of Gaza and the WB decades ago and turned that down. Then after Israel pulled out of Gaza, Hamas emerged with more power.

But it's the Israelis who don't want peace. Ok, sure thing champ.

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FoolInTheDesert t1_ja4a7yl wrote

> The majority of Israelis don't want peace (more specifically, they don't want to make the concessions required for Palestinians to accept peace).

The only concession that the majority of Palestinians are willing to accept is an end to the Jewish state and to push the Jews into the sea. This is the position of Hamas and a popular position among the people, even in Fatah/PLO controlled areas. The Palestinians rejected peace during the Camp David accords in the 90's when they were being offered everything except control of Jerusalem. Now they can't even get that offer back because of 25 years of settlements.

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thatsnotwait t1_ja4bj80 wrote

That's true for the old people in charge, but as the person I was responding to said, I highly doubt the regular guy in the Gaza Strip really feels that way. Unfortunately there aren't exactly credible opinion polls for the area.

−23

yaniv297 t1_ja5ees3 wrote

Sadly, the new generation of Palestinians is shaping up as even more violent than the older ones. The older ones usually know Hebrew, have worked in Israel in the past. They hate the situation, but they know Jewish people and see them as human. The new generation, many of them never even set foot in Israel. They've been brainwashed since birth, some of the propoganda show Jews as having devilish horns. Terrorist Social media is strong and everything is radicalized. We've had 13 years old killing people a few weeks ago. They upload that shit to Tik Tok. Many of them don't listen to the "old people in charge" because they are seen as too moderate. It's early days but I'm not optimistic at all about peace with this generation.

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yaniv297 t1_ja5icbs wrote

> The majority of Israelis don't want peace

Lol, you have no idea what's going on here. The majority of Israelis crave nothing more than peace. Every mother who gives birth fears the day her son will be recruited to the army. We're tired of terror attacks, missiles, etc. We envy European countries who mostly don't have to deal with that crap.

If true, actual peace was on the table, I guarantee that the huge majority of Israelis (other than a radical religious minority) will embrace it with both hands, and whoever leader brings it will be a legend forever.

What you mean to say is: the majority of Israel have grown tired of blood thirsty, radical Palestinian leaders, and currently believe peace isn't possible because the other side isn't ready. Which causes Israel to elect right wing leaders. Because frankly, with Hamas on the other side, the lefties who speak about peace sounds mostly out of touch with reality.

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bootlegvader t1_ja5ut42 wrote

> they don't want to make the concessions required for Palestinians to accept peace

It is weird to expect the victorious and stronger party to make concessions to achieve a goal that already most benefits the defeated and weaker party.

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thatsnotwait t1_ja5w867 wrote

Indeed, but that isn't relevant.

Though it really isn't that weird in the post-WW2 era. There's a reason Japan, West Germany, and South Korea aren't all States in the USA.

0

bootlegvader t1_ja60igo wrote

I will point that Germany's borders are vastly different than what they were pre-1939. *Japan's borders are different from what they used to hold pre-WW2 as they used to hold both Korea and Taiwan. Finally, the United States didn't fight the South Koreans.

9

[deleted] t1_ja4mzz1 wrote

[deleted]

−62

Teminite2 t1_ja4thb2 wrote

If that was the goal, IDF could've used the opportunity on the latest war to wipe gaza off the map.

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TerbiumInside t1_ja5odck wrote

Considering that the Palestinian population keeps increasing, Israel seems to be pretty shitty at ethnic cleansing.

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SkewerMeBaby t1_ja424i7 wrote

I know! I know!

Israeli should stop building illegal settlements!

−63

onlyfacts2000 t1_ja4ah6t wrote

As an Israeli, I 100% agree to that.

But with it, the Palestinian leadership should stop educating their children for extreme terror at once, and stop paying the terrorists or their families pensions for murdering Israelis.

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Godkun007 t1_ja44ymg wrote

Maybe Western governments should stop giving money to the PA to pay pensions to people who murder civilians.

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MemoryIcy4165 t1_ja49tq2 wrote

Maybe both things could happen. You one track mind is exactly what extremists in both side of this conflict hyper focus on. Quiet sad to see one in the wild. I hope you get more informed.

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Godkun007 t1_ja4aspu wrote

I agree settlements are bad. But the PA denies its own citizens from starting businesses keeping them poor and then pushes them into being terrorists as their only option to escape poverty.

Since the 90s, the West has been trying to help build up Palestine economically. This then gets stripped and sold for scrap to pay for the lavish lifestyles of the leaders and to pay terrorists.

Israel could disappear tomorrow and Palestine would just be a failed state because of the PA's kleptocratic "governance".

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sakanzc t1_ja57mrv wrote

Funny how such a sensible position gets so heavily downvoted just because it's not pro-Israel. Do they expect the Palestinians to just sit back and take it while their homes and land are stolen out from under them?

−25

Ahneg t1_ja5m3kw wrote

I’m not Israeli or even a Jew for that matter but I think it’s because Israel dragged all of it’s settlers kicking and screaming from Gaza and turned everything over to the PA and still got no peace. What they did get was rockets. A whole lot of rockets.

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