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waffleconedrone t1_j9jkgfq wrote

The government frames it as reparations for unjustly bombing them. I think people forget we really did bomb them into the stone age.

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Cult_ureS t1_j9jllgy wrote

And every time it's because they were trying to take territory.

Stay in your lane, NK.

(If I'm wrong or misinformed I'm happy to learn more history)

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yoortyyo t1_j9joasn wrote

Seventy years ago. Many of rhe soldiers were Chinese, whom like Germany, Japan, Italy, & Vietnam have become trade partners at worst to allies.

The standard of living in NK is among the worst in the world. Legend amd myth dont hold a candle to the kidnapping of Japanese citizens to the genocide of their own people.

Not ever making excuses or goody goody on American power but the datas clear.

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[deleted] t1_j9kbd9b wrote

[deleted]

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Prestigious_Pen5648 t1_j9khxo7 wrote

Korea invaded Korea?

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Accurate_Crazy_6251 t1_j9l4s5k wrote

Not sure if this is a “/s” but North Korea did invade South Kore then the UN authorized a force to fight back

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SelfAwareGrizzlyBear t1_j9plaqb wrote

Who imposed the border? Was it Koreans?

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Accurate_Crazy_6251 t1_j9rthhl wrote

While we probably should have done a vote: A) the USSR which controlled the North would have done a sham vote B) A bad border does not justify invasion

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SelfAwareGrizzlyBear t1_j9rz6li wrote

>While we probably should have done a vote:

An election wasn't needed. The Koreans already organized into a popular and sustaining government following Japanese surrender, the PRK. The USMGIK was explicitly tasked with eradicating it in the south, and formally outlawed it in December 1945. Some portions of it remained behind, especially on Jeju Island. These groups ended up protesting the 1948 sham election of Syngman Rhee, who responded with a self declared eradication campaign on the island, resulting in upwards of 100,000 civilians killed, injured or displaced.

In the North, the PRK remained in place and supported by the USSR until the 1948 election of Kim Il Sung, whereby the DPRK was proclaimed and the PRK committees were rolled into the Worker's Party of Korea.

>the USSR which controlled the North would have done a sham vote

There's no evidence of this, quite the contrary. The 1948 assembly elections in the South faced incredibly restrictive voter eligibility requirements. Only landowners were allowed to vote in populous areas, and single elder representatives voted on behalf of entire villages. The election was married by suppression and corruption. There's simply no evidence of corruption in the 1948 northern elections, which were open not just to North Koreans, but South Koreans as well

>A bad border does not justify invasion

Not a bad border, a partition imposed upon a people and maintained by a brutal dictator, his Japanese and sympathizing administrators, and the global imperial hegemon. Following the announcement of separate elections in early 1948, South Korea was already in an open state of civil war, with guerrillas fighting directly against ROK and occupying USMGIK troops. Large scale border clashes had already been commonplace by 1949, with South Korean troops making significant incursions across the border well before the Korean invasion of Korea. In the immediate runup to the invasion, South Korean forces had been stationed at Ogjin, which became one of the opening battles during the invasion. They had also captured Haeju, some 20 miles north of the 38th parallel

The war did not begin in 1950, it began prior even to 1948. The Korean invasion of Korea was simply an escalation in an existing civil war against an occupying force and it's collaborators, not unlike the American Revolution. Hell, the US didn't even care about the South Koreans. It deliberately bombed refugees fleeing from the violence during the 1950 offensive at Nogeun-ri. Some 400 South Korean refugees, nearly all women and children, were bombed and shot deliberately. The incident was covered up until 2001. And a South Korean commission found in 2008 evidence of nearly 200 other similar attacks on refugees by the US military

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s8018572 t1_j9la1ly wrote

What ? They fucking invaded south Korea. What's this weird stance?

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SelfAwareGrizzlyBear t1_j9pljjt wrote

When and by whom was the Korean peninsula divided in half?

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s8018572 t1_j9qhdpx wrote

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Division_of_Korea

You could check this, it's a natural development of cold war.Joint Commission fail to make progress. US rejected soviet's proposal.And Soviet rejected UN's proposal. With us withdrawed their troop from south Korea. North Korea decided to attack with Stalin's approved.

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SelfAwareGrizzlyBear t1_j9qkhpn wrote

>You could check this, it's a natural development of cold war.

Denying agency of Koreans over their own nation was a natural development of the cold war? What authority did the US and Russia have to delegate what the PRK could do with is own land?

>US rejected soviet's proposal.And Soviet rejected UN's proposal

When was the PRK consulted in all this?

>With us withdrawed their troop from south Korea. North Korea decided to attack with Stalin's approved.

Border skirmishes had been ongoing well prior to the Korean invasion of Korea. As well, the installed dictator in the South was just finishing up a self identified eradication campaign at Jeju after unification demonstrators started making demands. Upwards of 100,000 people were killed, injured or displaced.

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s8018572 t1_j9qnjgj wrote

What authority? Military occupation authority? Soviet even directly rejected UN's proposal. There's nothing can be done at the moment.

Talk about dictator, you know Kim Il-sung a dictator too,right?

Millions of death or exile cause he want to "unify" Korea by war. He wants to be another Mao as he won the Chinese civil war. Do you know he purged the leadership of southern communist after PLA retake Pyongyang for him? And then he purged pro-soviet and pro-sino members to make his Kim dynasty.He called them spy from the south lul.

Both dictator was shit,but guess what? South nowaday is better than north thousands time. And south is not a dictatorship anymore.

Even if US want to consult with PRK, do you think PRK wouldn't listen to Soviet?

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SelfAwareGrizzlyBear t1_j9qv4f0 wrote

>What authority? Military occupation authority?

So Japan was justified in exporting Korean women as sex slaves because they occupied the peninsula? If your analysis begins and ends at might makes right, I really don't know what to tell you.

> Soviet even directly rejected UN's proposal.

Why?

>There's nothing can be done at the moment.

The US did not have to occupy korea. They did not have to outlaw the PRK. They did not have to install Rhee, who would go on to block reunification. They did not have to commit war crimes at Jeju. They did not have to air strike refugees at Nogeun-ri

>Talk about dictator, you know Kim Il-sung a dictator too,right?

Not particularly, no. The DPRK largely absorbed the PRK in the North, and there isn't much of any evidence to show that the election of Kim faced faced significant malfeasance. The same can't be said for Rhee. The 1948 South Korean Assembly election can hardly even be called such, considering how voting was held in the same manner as under Japanese colonial administration, where only landowners in populous areas could vote, and where single elders voted for entire villages.

>Millions of death or exile cause he want to "unify" Korea by war

Why did Kim want to unify Korea? Because the partition of the peninsula was facially illegitimate. Koreans clearly did not want it, seeing how they never voted to partition.

>He wants to be another Mao as he won the Chinese civil war. Do you know he purged the leadership of southern communist after PLA retake Pyongyang for him? And then he purged pro-soviet and pro-sino members to make his Kim dynasty.He called them spy from the south lul.

Narrativizing isn't going to get you anywhere. The USMGIK banned labor organization and the PRK. Rhee eradicated an entire island of opposition

>Both dictator was shit,but guess what? South nowaday is better than north thousands time.

Surely that has nothing to do with South Korea receiving the equivalent in US funding of several Marshal Plans, while the North received more bombs than the entirety of Europe during the second world war. What's the union situation in the South today?

Leaving the peninsula to its own devices and governance surely would have led to significantly better outcomes for both halves. The North wouldn't have been bombed to rubble and the south would have stumbled upon an at-least-vaguely stable leader far sooner than it has

>Even if US want to consult with PRK, do you think PRK wouldn't listen to Soviet?

Did the PRK have some supremely endowed obligation to not listen to the soviets? Considering the structure of the PRK, it almost surely would have aligned with the USSR, hence why the US spent so much time and effort installing a dictator in the south, smashing popular dissent in the south, and aiding and abetting in it's atrocities

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s8018572 t1_j9se446 wrote

Lul, so you didn't even know the problem which is he started the war. Are you consider there's something like justified invasion war? Especially it's quite weak reason to do it.

American left the peninsula before Korean war so that's why Stalin approved Kim's action.

If invasion was successed, there would be a huge politicial purge and dissident.

Do you think there's no purge after CCP win the Chinese civil war?

North Korean people are starving to death today. And you're crying south didn't have strong union power.

There isn't much of crime evidence of early north korean election because North Korea still a dictatorship.There's no one could enter the border to investigate it.

I don't know. You keep avoiding the thing is Kim is a dictator too. At least South was a democracy now, they democratized with June Democracy Movement in 1987.

The demonstrations made by mass of people, unlike north Korea, did have even have a demonstration? Oops, I guess not. The mass of north Korean people couldn't have demonstration because of their government's totalitarian dictatorship ,not because they lived in heaven.

Are you sure you have your number right? U.S. dropped 1.6 million tons in the European theater, and they dropped 635,000 tons in Entire Korean war.( So naturally it included south Korean's territory)

South received aid from American, north did received aid from China and Soviet too.

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