I'm being completely serious when I say that I can't think of an example across the DMV where bike lanes went in and made the car traffic worse. Like, actually worse measured by real quantitative counts. Lots of people like to complain but rarely even bother to have the data to back it up.

There have been a couple examples where political pressure reversed a change but the numbers never actually backed it up.

Some of it is survivorship bias. DDOT simply isn't going to advance any sort of project where their numbers suggest car traffic would get really bad.

Some of it is that traffic is way more resilient than we realize. Trips start and end far from any one corridor so people who know that a route is no longer no good (not that NJ was ever any good in the first place) will make changes way earlier than right there.

And better yet this cascades as we get more and more people on bikes.

K Stret in MVT is a complete mess bc of the new bike lanes. Did not need those on both sides of the street

Is it *actually* a mess? As in are the intersections seeing fewer cars make it through and the levels of service drop?

That road has been 2 lanes as long as I can remember anyway. The only change was parking on one side went away to make more total room for the bike lanes.

It’s a mess bc now with the bike lanes there is ZERO place for Ubers and Uber eats drivers to pick up. With a number of restaurants and apts units in the area it’s a mess. Also never really even see anyone using those bike lanes. Just don’t see the need for them on both sides of the road there.

>driving

You are the problem.

I live a block away from K st. in MVT, and cross it almost daily. I don't know what you're calling a mess, it doesn't seem any more or less a mess than the rest of the neighborhood. 4th southbound approaching 395 is way worse.

That’s a mess 2 but those bike lanes have not improved traffic flow on K right there. Can’t stand those empty barley used bike lanes.

Would you consider them better used if they had standstill traffic like 4th street?

Bike lanes on 1 side and a mix of parking/drop off & pick up zones on the other side. That would be ideal IMO.

100% I now feel safe biking down NJ and it makes it a lot easier to go N/S in that part of town. No impact on driving either. My only concern is that driving north from NY is extremely dangerous as there is a blind merge from 2 lanes to 1; no one seems to know what to do and it happens really suddenly. They need to add signage or adjust the lane markings for the merge.

> there is a blind merge from 2 lanes to 1

Right by the fire station/speed camera, right? Yeah, people end up in the left turn lane and try to jam their way over to the right lane. That intersection, in both directions, needs signs on the stoplight arms indicating the inside lane is left turn only so people can see it coming.

But that’s always been the case. The roads always been two lanes with a parking lane.

But like you say, it all comes with more places opening up along the road and rise in ride sharing. Those things happened with or without bikes.

But still, we have the data on trip times along the street today and in the past. Bike lanes aren’t leading to longer trips by car in dc. Funny enough there’s evidence that ride share makes congestion worse so if we are gonna restrict something let’s restrict the thjng that is actually making traffic worse.

I was recently driving there and there were cars parked with blinkers on without a driver on the east bound side. There was ton of parking available on the west bound side. I think this area should probably be designated as drop off/pickup area which would elevate the issue of non availability of space. Can’t help if if a driver ignores it though.

Only need bike lanes on 1 side there

>2 but those bike lanes have not improved traffic flow on K right there

You do realize not all road improvement projects have to make your life, as a driver, more convenient... Right?

That makes sense, thats what happens anyway. And the north side of K when you cross over to NE is really not great because of backed up westbound car traffic.

Everytime us "crazy radical cyclists" try to say stuff like this with actual numbers, data, and studies to back it up, we get told off about how we don't know anything and just want cars and drivers to burn.

There's a field of study called urban planning and traffic engineering. It's real science, and shocker, it works in practice. Counterintuitively, reducing lanes and reducing lane width in addition to making other modes of transport more hospitable actually improves traffic in most cases.

Snark and pent up frustration aside, glad to have you on our side OP. Now continue down the rabbit hole of an urban planning and city design youtube channel like "Not Just Bikes" and take the orange pill. You'll be a full blown advocate in a matter of weeks.

Thank you for sharing! I am both a cyclist and a driver. I understand this.

Head on over to the Chevy chase and Cleveland Park listservs and spread the good word please.

Seems like the problem is Ubers and Uber eats drivers acting illegally, nothing to do with cyclists.

Sounds like you should hop on a bike, plenty of room in the bike lane.

They are doing their job. Do you really expect Uber eats drivers to try to find parking? Do you want your Uber picking you up far from your location on a rainy night? Recognize the reality of the situation and don’t live in a fantasy land.

Not being facetious but it should be a goal for re-urbanism to make driving worse.

Only then will we be able to convince people to reorient their transportation to safer and more sustainable means.

Nah. No thanks. I’m not a biker. Not for me. Uber, walking, or my car is how I get around the area.

But how could you midly inconvenience suburban commuters??? One more lane bro please I promise it'll fix traffic /s

That is a main bike route for a ton of people. Both sides are definitely needed and it isn't even good enough since drivers are constantly pulling maneuvers and blocking the lane.

Maybe the corporations responsible should be lobbying the city to convert street parking into delivery/loading zones. It's odd that you put the blame on the bike lanes instead of the business model of Uber and doordash which is ruining the city.

This. At some point we have to move from appeasing all drivers to making it markedly better to switch to other modes of transit whether it’s bikes, metro, or bus.

Agree to disagree there. Never see those being used very much.

Ruining the city? Lol

Agree to disagree there as well

I ride on K St all of the time because it is the main route across the city from NE to NW. It gets a ton of bike traffic so I really don't understand your anecdote about not getting any use.

You don't think constant double parking and blocking bike lanes is ruining the city? It's extremely dangerous and unfair to everyone else. Again, not blaming the drivers. We need less on street parking and more delivery/loading zones for delivery drivers.

https://www.reddit.com/r/washingtondc/comments/zdrxkv/as_a_driver_new_jersey_ave_nw_has_absolutely/iz38tkg/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf&context=3

Be living in the neighborhood and seeing those empty bike lines all the time.

> Do you really expect Uber eats drivers to try to find parking?

Yes, I expect people to follow laws of general applicability. "I don't want to follow the law because it's more profitable if I don't" is some libertarian hellscape shit.

You’re not living in reality if you think that. It’s 2022.

Bike lanes always look empty because bikes don't get stuck in traffic. I'm through a block in 30 seconds. The only time I have ever seen true bicycle traffic was when I used to commute via 15th NW downtown. Even then you could blink and it's gone. That's why we choose to bike. It's faster and it makes more sense at the scale of the city.

Why remove the bike lane? Just use the on street parking that's already there and remove to parking spots for delivery.

It gets so busy on 15th St. NW. They really need a similar protected bike lane on the 17th St. side of the White House that extends all the way to Constitution.

So when I’m sitting at alta Strada and only or 1 or 2 bikes go by in 90 mins…..

We aren’t going to ever agree here on this topic. But enjoy your day

I know we'll never agree. I see you spreading anti bike propaganda on this subreddit all of the time.

It’s not propaganda 😂

It’s my opinion. You don’t have to agree or like it that’s okay. Not everyone loves bikers and bike lanes. Sorry.

watching those crocodile tears over the past 6.5 months has been legendary

Yes I do.

I used to bike on New Jersey as well when it didn't have bike lanes, which always frustrated and frightened me. The new protected bike lanes ensure that I stay off the sidewalk for pedestrians and make me feel a million times safer. I'm so excited.

You should put that presaved note in all your Ubers.

“Please find the nearest parking spot and I will find you”

I literally have. Or told them to pull into a specific spot where parking isn't legal but standing is.

That’s what up. Practice what you preach. I respect it

Move aside Bravo TV.

Ur right. I’ve loved what they’ve don on New Jersey ave

The down to one lane w turn only lanes is such a smarter move and it’s so much drafter for pedestrians.

I’d love that on FL ave too in the same area past Rhode Island ave intersection

Right, like it’s one thing to have a city accommodate ppl getting in and out but it should discourage use of cars within the city and do public options

What I don’t understand is why were bike lanes not protected from the start? You’d think it would be super obvious to put them outside where cars parked, not between street parking and traffic. Just a total lack of common sense from the traffic engineering profession

This is because of the "don't spend money on anything that doesn't benefit me" mindset. I would argue that after commuting to DC for decades, we'd all be safer if everyone slowed down a bit. One accident, police car, etc can really upset the apple cart. Just today there was a construction project on N Capital where they closed lanes on each part of the intersection. Buses stopping in the remaining single lane, equipment blocking parts, etc. The workers don't care that it took over 30 mins to traverse that single block. Moving the bikes into their space and keeping them safe reduces incidents and the same complainers won't like them taking a lane in the roadway, despite the fact that they can probably ride 25MPH.

> And as a driver, perhaps counterintuitively, this will ultimately reduce traffic if it encourages more people to bike or scooter. That’s one less car you’re stuck behind in traffic. The city needs more of this.

But remember, if a motorcyclist filters past you at a stop, that's an affront to your personhood and you should endanger their life to stop their wicked behavior, it's your duty.

/s

Just one more lane bro, I swear that will fix traffic! Just let me build one more lane!

I think that it's simply that its easier to paint a line on the street, then invest in actual bike lane infrastructure

How much do you want to bet that the ven diagram between those people and the people that opposed public housing in their neighborhoods is a circle?

If NextDoor is to be believed, if there's anything fewer than three lanes on every residential street, there will be nothing but gridlock everywhere

>K Stret in MVT is a complete mess bc of the new bike lanes. Did not need those on both sides of the street

K Street NW into NE is absolutely worse. 100%.

At least someone else realize the realizes the reality of that mess that those new bike lanes created

It’s not that we don’t believe you it’s that there’s always 50 more of you screaming your fackin’ heads off “BAN ALL CARS” and “FUCK CARS” and “cars aren’t necessary for modern life” and it just makes y’all look like a bunch of nurjibs incapable of compromise

Agree that it's great and hasn't impacted traffic - but whatever they did while they were building this was confusing as hell. I drive up NJ often and literally couldnt figure out what lane I was supposed to be in (there were literally lines everywhere). I hope they continue doing this, and it's all good on NJ now, but considering how careless drivers can be here - they should really find a way to fine-tune the process.

> I drive up NJ often and literally couldnt figure out what lane I was supposed to be in (there were literally lines everywhere).

1000%. It was chaos at times. No one had a fucking clue where they were supposed to be. Thankfully that was a relatively short period of time.

5th street/park street going south and warder street going north, on the blocks near Wash hospital center. Didn't really improve the bike experience that much, but significant driver wait times at the lights when going south. Same with Irving Street in that area. By(unnecessarily) eliminating the right turn lane to the hospital, traffic backs up at nurse shift change.

> It’s not that we don’t believe you it’s that there’s always 50 more of you screaming your fackin’ heads off “BAN ALL CARS” and “FUCK CARS” and “cars aren’t necessary for modern life” and it just makes y’all look like a bunch of nurjibs incapable of compromise

You're taking a systemic criticism personally, as if you're a car. You're not a car, you're a driver, and nobody would ever consider banning drivers from places. We just advocate for limiting your stupid fucking car. :D

The bikers and the walkers and the bus-riders and the metro-riders have been asked to "find another way" and make compromises within their own lives to accommodate the shit-for-brains car-driver who drives into the city every day. I cram onto a bus to work everyday that's held up because 300,000 people insist on driving themselves to work every day in their own car. I stop at intersections, wait for the crosswalk to turn, and then wait some more to ensure that those impatient car-driving assholes who aren't looking for me, who need to make that right-turn-on-red or left-on-green-before-the-other-lane-gets-into-the-intersection don't run me over. Or I cross the street to avoid the dangerous part of the crosswalk that allows people to cross while cars are also allowed to enter the street. I walk 20 minutes to my nearest metro stop if I take the metro in the morning. I slam on my brakes at every intersection as I ride my bike up and down 15th NW because cars decide to pull out in front of me. I stop and wait at a green light on NJ and Q St NW so that cars waiting to turn right won't run me over in the bike lane they can't see. I live in the city so that I won't have to commute, and if I lived outside the city I'd live near a metro or bus stop. When I lived in Leesburg, I rode the commuter bus for an hour each way, but it felt like that bus was commuting through a sea of angry drivers, something I can't imagine doing every day. I live in a time where cemeteries are filled with people who have been killed by cars - how many cars and car-drivers have been killed by a walker or bike rider or bus-sitter colliding with the car in traffic?

I've changed my whole fucking life to accommodate cars and people driving cars.

The sad thing is that you've probably gotten 5 downvotes and 5 or fewer people responding to you about cars and it's so enraged you that you can, in your mind, exaggerate it to 50 responses from 50 people, and it "feels" right because your personality and lifestyle is so wrapped up in being able to drive a car. Nobody has ever done anything to you that would require you to change your lifestyle - at most you've lost a few extra minutes in commuting that you weren't entitled to anyways. The modern lifestyle has been totally warped by the unnatural and destructive privilege of being able to travel as fast as you want in your own personal vehicle, unconstrained by the costs of biological energy or muscle or distance or time. I think most people who advocate against cars today would agree that you, the car driver, have been ceded too much ground in this world.

Nobody is saying to ban cars, just to limit them.

And it's a literal fact that adding more lanes doesn't improve traffic at all, because when you add a lane, people change their habits which negates the addition of a new lane.

In comparison, adding a bike lane or a dedicated bus lane can improve car traffic.

Also.

> The sad thing is that you've probably gotten 5 downvotes and 5 or fewer people responding to you about cars and it's so enraged you that you can, in your mind, exaggerate it to 50 responses from 50 people, and it "feels" right because your personality and lifestyle is so wrapped up in being able to drive a car. Nobody has ever done anything to you that would require you to change your lifestyle - at most you've lost a few extra minutes in commuting that you weren't entitled to anyways. The modern lifestyle has been totally warped by the unnatural and destructive privilege of being able to travel as fast as you want in your own personal vehicle, unconstrained by the costs of biological energy or muscle or distance or time. I think most people who advocate against cars today would agree that you, the car driver, have been ceded too much ground in this world.

I'm reminded of this person. She doesn't want to walk at all and doesn't want buildings to be close together. Basically the complete example of a selfish person.