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LeDeepPenseur OP t1_jdylid0 wrote

Reply to comment by MoreCleverUserName in Gut Renovation on Wardman Style Rowhouse - Budget Discussion/Advice by LeDeepPenseur

Forgot to add. The basement will have a separate entrance and a kitchen. I also received quotes for $500K for the same job. I’d rather get a new house at that point.

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MoreCleverUserName t1_jdymom5 wrote

Yeah $250k for all of that is so low that I would be worried about the quality of the work. You’re going to spend $8k or so on midrange appliances for a kitchen/laundry for the ADU and I‘d assume you’d want higher end stuff for the upstairs kitchen…. So $20k just on the kitchen appliances between the two, almost 10% of that bid, kinda gives you some perspective. and that’s before you pay for any plumbing, flooring, electrical work, cabinets….

i would try to get a bid from Harmony, they are very reputable and local, owner is a Petworth guy and they do a lot of these. I would expect them to come in around $400k ish. Case Design is also really good but a little more expensive.

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QueMasPuesss t1_jdyuasv wrote

250k is really not “cheap.” It only appears so because many design + build firms add multiple layers of costs and inefficiencies and profit (and also potentially systems for delivering a better, more reliable product, depending on their experience.)

Let’s say the house is 2500 sq ft. 250k is 100 sq for renovating. 100 a sq ft has is just a bit low on the sticks and bricks of building a new 2500 sq ft home from scratch (though pandemic has messed with hard costs, but it’s starting to come down a bit.) But it gives us a cost baseline from which to work.

Digging out a basement CAN be expensive, but a lot of that stems from particular engineering complexity and how tall the basement it is to begin with, how much extra engineering needs to go in, etc.

If it’s a simple job, dudes literally go in with jackhammers and shovels and then pour a new foundation and footing walls after. Labor shouldn’t be more than 10 grand (3 - 5 dudes over a weel - 10 days) plus cost of materials, plus profit for the sub.

Once you have the blank canvas, you’re building from scratch-ish, but the main expensive pieces should be electrical, plumbing, and hvac. None of which should be more than 15k or so for systems (excluding finishes.) add in some structural changes here, plus reframing interior walls, let’s just round up to 100k before the finish out.

A decent Ikea kitchen should run around 10 - 15k, bathroom for material and labor should be 7.5 - 25k per depending on complexity, (let’s call it 15k for an average for 3 bathrooms - 45k), then another 10k for drywall, 10k for interior painting, 10k for flooring (refinishing original hardwoods and adding LVP in basement) then 10k on lighting fixtures and other odds and ends. That gets us up to 200k. These are rough rough numbers but more or less ballpark if you’re working with a one man shop GC and not a build + design firm.

Throw 50k on top for windows, finish trim work, exterior painting, landscaping, permits, and extra overhead, and 250k is achievable. There will be a lot less handholding, a less bespoke experience, and a lot more design + supervision heavy lifting for the homeowner. A guy with his own dedicated crew on payroll can likely achieve the above for around 150k, which is how the dedicated flippers make money on deals homeowners can’t.

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MoreCleverUserName t1_jdzm19t wrote

I don’t think the prices you mention here are realistic in today’s market.

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QueMasPuesss t1_je03hwu wrote

Just renovated a house last year so not talking out of my ass ;) Was more or less my own GC though

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LeDeepPenseur OP t1_je04np3 wrote

Thanks for the thorough answer! Did you have to get your GC license for that or are you in the trade? And what was your budget (gut reno) and did you have to move during the construction?

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NPRjunkieDC t1_jdzr65q wrote

August bought a 780sf condo in Atlanta. Moved kitchen + full bath + laundry location + knocked down 2 walls + new half bath + new floors + new trim + lifted ceiling some areas. With IKEA kitchen almost 90K and I had a super affordable contractor.

One bathroom in DC recently cost me 16K . I had budgeted 8K. Left original floor.

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LeDeepPenseur OP t1_jdyoo90 wrote

Agreed. Chitchatting some of the developers in the neighborhood in DC, it sounds like that’s what they spend for houses that are going over $1.3m. But how? Finishes are nice. And Bosch appliances.

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MoreCleverUserName t1_jdypw6q wrote

It’s just an expensive project. Windows for example, if you can get decent quality double hung windows for under $600 each, that’s a good deal, and my Wardman has 14 windows, two of which are massively oversized. HVAC ductwork costs a lot, the hvac equipment itself costs a lot, decent engineered hardwood flooring coats $8/square foot just for the materials. It adds up FAST. Even a basic vanity with engineered stone top is gonna run $600 at Home Depot (although you could easily spend $3k on a high end oversized single sink vanity). I think the gravel fill for the basement (goes under the slab) is $4k right there, just for someone to come shoot rocks at your floor (but it is very cool to watch).

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LeDeepPenseur OP t1_jdyq6qt wrote

Yeah — well, let me see how it goes. Have you done something similar too?

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MoreCleverUserName t1_jdzluus wrote

Yes but as two separate projects, one for the dig down and basement and the other for the upstairs. The second project is wrapping up now which is how I know current pricing on a lot of these things, appliances for example…. I just bought a house full of them.

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LeDeepPenseur OP t1_je06mhj wrote

I thought about having separate projects as well. But it ends up being more costly is what I was told. I’d have to live somewhere for 6 months at least. Good luck with your renovation!

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