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snow_michael t1_iy64t4e wrote

Reply to comment by TelescopiumHerscheli in TIL that loganberries aren't a separate species of berry, but are a cross between blackberries and raspberries. by TelescopiumHerscheli

The wikipedia article contains details, including the species name

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TelescopiumHerscheli OP t1_iy7msi5 wrote

How strange! When I look at Wikipedia, I don't see a species name, nor do I see any evidence that they breed true. I can see a hybrid name (× loganobaccus) within the Rubus genus, but I don't see a species name. Nor does the version of the article that I can see say anything about them breeding true. Are you looking at a different language Wiki, perhaps?

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snow_michael t1_iy8bmjr wrote

Can you see "Progeny from Logan's original plant was introduced to Europe in 1897"?

That's the 'breeding true', otherwise there would be no loganberries grown from that progeny in e.g. the UK

In my garden I have loganberry canes that put out runners every year which I give away to friends and family, and which grow into fruit-bearing loganberry bushes, and I - well, my gardener - has grown loganberry plants from the seeds of fruit from those canes

In the UK an X in a species name identifies a non-fertile hybrid (q.v. Liger) so the species name is Rubus loganobaccus ref. CABI digital library

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TelescopiumHerscheli OP t1_iy8j76i wrote

The 'X' does indeed indicate that the cross is non-fertile. This is why it's not a species: members of a species can breed to produce "vigorous fertile offspring", which is not what we have here. Reproduction by runners isn't "breeding true", because it's not breeding. It's asexual reproduction. Reproduction from seeds isn't "breeding true" unless the seeds produce the same kind of fruits and plants as the parents. If you have evidence to the contrary, please would you provide us with a suitable link. Thanks.

Loganberries do not form a separate species, but are a hybrid. If you believe otherwise, please provide an unambiguous reference from a respectable source that supports your claim. Thanks.

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