locri t1_jeczqhq wrote on March 31, 2023 at 2:46 AM

Reply to comment by [deleted] in TIL of Cáin Adomnáin, dubbed "Europe's first human rights treaty". Created in the year 697, was a set of laws - which kings across Ireland and parts of Scotland mutually agreed to follow - that guaranteed the safety of non-combatants in warfare. by Madbrad200

Raiding, yeah.

I'm not going to justify it, but if your crops fail you'd rather it was someone else's problem rather than the problem of your kids. If your neighbour doesn't have any food, well, then I'm sure they have something to sell.

Not a justification, it was just a very different time. There were fewer food banks and homeless shelters...

Sawrock t1_jed8p5d wrote on March 31, 2023 at 4:06 AM

They could’ve at least been efficient and resorted to cannibalism.

locri t1_jedgwqy wrote on March 31, 2023 at 5:33 AM

At some stage between the neolithic and bronze age this became highly taboo and only ever something you'd accuse your enemies of, kind of like the human sacrifice wickerman thing. Slavery on the other hand was borderline socially acceptable. Slavery is considered abhorrent in our society due to a completely different mentality caused by an almost unthinkably different upbringing.

It's important to understand that every society and culture has some questionable elements, personally I think it's odd a lot of people's take away from this is to stop questioning their own and working ahead of it.

chrisjfinlay t1_jee4x92 wrote on March 31, 2023 at 11:00 AM

That proposal sounds quite modest.

Hattix t1_jedk4jn wrote on March 31, 2023 at 6:12 AM

When we think of slavery, we think of commercial, industrialised, chattel slavery.

That's a uniquely modern thing. Slaves back then (even earlier, in Rome) were not workers. Nobody lost their job or livelihood to a slave like how the Americans surrender their jobs to dollar-a-day convicts today. You'd never see a slave at a forge, at a kiln, at the wainwright, working the docks, or sewing clothes. It'd be insulting to everyone to imply a slave was appropriate for any of those roles.

They were wives, they were domestic servants, errand boys, messengers. The only real "job" they were allowed to do was in subsistence agriculture, but everyone in the community did that anyway at harvest and sowing time.

Slaves were another mouth to feed and very few people, but for the richest and most powerful, wanted that.

tsaimaitreya t1_jedt1vn wrote on March 31, 2023 at 8:16 AM

Americans are really into downplaying slavery to make their version more significant...

Hattix t1_jef2dz3 wrote on March 31, 2023 at 3:26 PM

I'm British.

locri t1_jedl5dq wrote on March 31, 2023 at 6:25 AM

What?

So you're a yeoman with a bit of land to farm on or a hunter or a fisher for your village one day and the next you're... What? You're definitely not in the same place and same status.

It's all the same, the reason people viewed it differently isn't because slavery was worse but because bronze age people didn't view those of other tribes as really anything like them, like animals. This is likely due to isolation and lower amounts of contact between tribes and people, they had tin trade but this was hardly globalisation. Even then, in each city state they'd probably maintain this tribalism right into the iron age. Consider how long it took people who could forge steel to treat everyone equally.

Honestly, at some stage you really do have to say the ancients were just a little primitive. I'm sorry, I know that's a history no no, but this is a slavery conversation. This time you're dealing with it.

Hattix t1_jedmakh wrote on March 31, 2023 at 6:40 AM

Who did you mean to reply to?

You've accidentally replied to me. Who was the Redditor saying slavery wasn't the lowest of castes? It definitely wasn't me, and I'd like to see the best in people so I think you just replied to the wrong person.