quantumfucker t1_j4veps6 wrote on January 18, 2023 at 3:12 PM

Reply to comment by TheSnozzwangler in Dutch Students using ChatGPT to finish homework; Teachers aren't noticing by Parking_Attitude_519

What constitutes a “strong general base of knowledge” is a wild moving target and relies a lot on what society will be like. We obviously cannot teach everyone everything, so we need to make decisions based on the fact that public schools exist to prepare children for the future. If new tools become part of that, then they should be taught, just as we now teach programming in high school.

In a hypothetical world of accessible real-time translation, what exactly is the point of teaching foreign languages to students as a standard? Why do we need as many dedicated translators when anyone can work abroad using it? The people who need or want to pursue a finer study of it still can as a higher-education subject the same way people still can choose to study the classics in college and find niche applications of that.

TheSnozzwangler t1_j4vmlma wrote on January 18, 2023 at 4:04 PM

>In a hypothetical world of accessible real-time translation, what exactly is the point of teaching foreign languages to students as a standard?

>Why do we need as many dedicated translators when anyone can work abroad using it?

It really depends on how the technology functions and how it is received. In your hypothetical, I am assuming that we're talking about is something like the google translate app but with more accurate translations, and not something fantastical like a Babel fish from H2G2.

If that is the sort of translation device we're talking about, I actually don't believe that it would open up work abroad to everyone. A large portion of working abroad is working alongside, communicating, and generally integrating with people of another culture. They not only want someone with whatever skills they're looking for, but they also want someone that knows the language and will fit into their culture.

Utilizing a translator app creates a sort of barrier to your integration abroad. At some level you are always going to be an outsider, and may even be ostracized to some degree. Imagine going to a bar after work and trying to have a conversation with your coworkers using a translator app, or trying to take a business call using it. It's just not an adequate replacement for fluency in the language. A foreign company would rather take someone that knows the language than someone who doesn't.

>And even if the tech falls short, wouldn’t it at least be prudent to teach students how to work with it?

This is the other problem; I think there are going to be a lot of situations where the tech would fall short. There just aren't simple 1:1 translations of every sentence, and a translator app would have significant issues in day to day use. For everyday utterances, there can be a significant amount of pragmatic meaning encoded into the sentences that requires understanding of unsaid context to decode (for example utterances with implicature or sarcasm).

As for if the tech should be taught to students, if it functions as-is, then is there really a need to teach it? Assuming it's a translator app that works just by plugging in a sentence and receiving an output, what else is there left to teach about it?

I just don't see it as beneficial to progressing a student towards the goal of fluency. The goal in any class is for the student to develop an understanding of the material, not just learn the means by which they can receive good marks.