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ryanq99 t1_it8dfx7 wrote

I wouldnt believe just anyone, most people that claim they have seen ufos are loonies.

Some of these guys are highly trained, highly educated pilots that all witness similar phenomenon, and from their perspective, the "craft" or whatever it is seems to surpass our technological abilities.

I used to be very adamant that life exists but in no way are they here on Earth. Im a little more open to the idea now.

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rocketsocks t1_it8xyf6 wrote

Highly trained pilots are still subject to the same cognitive biases that most folks are. The important thing is whether or not the claims are evaluated rigorously and scientifically. And every single time that the due diligence is put into these claims the result is that the "UFO" is identified as very likely something else such as a balloon or another plane.

This alone is a problem because it completely inverts the burden of proof. The burden should be that the very first step is to put in the rigorous work to identify anything it might be that is a mundane explanation, and only then to put together a strong case of positive evidence that there is something odd and unexplainable going on. However, that's not the way these things have been going. Instead the typically pattern is a half-assed investigation at the level of "I dunno, it looks weird" followed by jumping to the conclusion that something that "looks weird" must be an alien spaceship or a classified spy plane or something. And so instead it falls to a small group of amateurs to actually put in the work and then they'll come back and say "oh yeah, this is actually a video of another plane, and here's the exact plane it was", which is an unreasonable level of burden for them, but that's the sorry state things are in because so many people are so biased toward wanting to believe these things are alien spacecraft.

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ryanq99 t1_it8z15j wrote

I am overly skeptical about everything. 2 years ago I would have scoffed and rolled my eyes at anyone even considering ufo stories to be legit.

My natural inclination is absolutely not to believe in ufos. The opposite. Naturally, I think it’s complete bullshit.

I now think there are too many accounts from reasonable people to just completely write them off.

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rocketsocks t1_it90s35 wrote

OK, go watch Mick West's videos on youtube and get back to me. The evidence really is not there, at all, it's universally a lack of rigor that is being filled in by a bias toward extraordinary interpretations.

Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence, and the evidence is very much lacking.

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ryanq99 t1_it91ltp wrote

I will watch. Any specific video to start with?

Also, there is no extraordinary claim. No claim at all actually... What I am talking about is testimonies of witnessed phenomenon that have actual video and data. There is no conclusion, we dont know what it is.

There are anomalies in the data. It is up to us to use the data to come to a conclusion.

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ryanq99 t1_ith4qm4 wrote

Thanks for the resources, his explanations do make sense to explain civilian sightings but not for the US Navy sighting.

They see planes all the time, they fly them. The sensors and recordings picked up something not recognized by the Navy which is why this is a big deal. They 100% know of every vehicle in their airspace, it’s not possible for it to be a plane.

The other videos of civilians claiming to see a “tic-tac” all look like planes. The one from the US Navy does not look like a plane. I have a hard time believing it’s a lens flair and none of their experts considered it. There was sensor data and eye-witness accounts from 4 pilots. It’s not a flair.

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Kind_Demand_6672 t1_it8fsgl wrote

"Highly trained, highly educated" does not prevent someone from experiencing the human condition. I've seen people, who are celebrated experts in their field, say stupid stuff a ton of times.

For instance, my cousin is an A-10 pilot, he also believes Tr*mp won the 2020 election.

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ryanq99 t1_it8gs67 wrote

Absolutely, but when multiple highly regarded pilots account for witnessing the same phenomenon and agree whatever is was surpasses our current understanding of technical and physical limitations, I think it’s worth looking into.

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Latyon t1_it8qxg4 wrote

You can be highly trained and highly educated and still be a looney toon.

See: Ben "the pyramids are grain silos" Carson

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ryanq99 t1_it8ttr0 wrote

Are you saying they’re all loonies, therefore we should ignore rule out anything anyone says if it’s about ufos?

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Latyon t1_it8wmhh wrote

No.

I have an idea though - how about they show us the data they claim exists?

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ryanq99 t1_it98zi6 wrote

My other comment got auto-removed. Lets try again.

Look into David Fravor. As far as I am aware there isn't a logical explanation for the phenomenon himself and 3 others witnessed.

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Latyon t1_it99d73 wrote

Is this the Gimbal guy?

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ryanq99 t1_it9bmim wrote

I was removed automatically again...

Yes I think it is the gimbal guy.

Words words words words dont remove my comment please

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Latyon t1_it9cin8 wrote

The Gimbal is unexplained but not unexplainable. And if people are claiming that these things are impossible crafts and that there is evidence that they have collected, then show us.

Otherwise, it's "My girlfriend goes to another school so you can't meet her"

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ryanq99 t1_it9ilan wrote

Btw I think youre reply got removed like mine have been.

Reddit deletes almost all of my comments so I started using reveddit to see if my post made it or not.

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ryanq99 t1_it9jr1n wrote

I see you asked for data in the comment that got removed.

Here it is: https://www.navair.navy.mil/foia/documents

Are you planning on doing something with the data or was that just to shut down the conversation?

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Latyon t1_it9labo wrote

I will, I will look at it, thank you.

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ryanq99 t1_it9mmhl wrote

There are hundreds of pages of docs and emails in that link, along with video from sensor data. IMO easier to listen to David Fravor on Lex Friedmans podcast. Worth a watch.

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ryanq99 t1_it9fl30 wrote

They have data. The data shows whatever it is, its seemingly flying faster and more unusual than anything we understand currently. That's it.

I, and the people that presented the data did not claim what it is. Whatever it is, something is happening. Its not nothing.

That alone is worth investigating.

"I have a girlfriend at another school" is a claim.

"Here is data we do not understand, what is it?" is not a claim.

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AP-the-RD t1_it8fk48 wrote

I’m in agreement with you, the past 4 years have seen a sea change in how the topic is being viewed/discussed and I can assure you, regardless of what our government/military agencies say, the do know more than they are letting on/revealing and there absolutely is more evidence than what has been revealed thus far.

They are taking this seriously despite what is revealed in public and to think otherwise is delusional. As you said, there are too many reports/testimony from highly credible witnesses to ignore. Also to use a straw man argument like 1 in 5 people claim they’ve seen a ghost again doesn’t address the issue at hand.

We’re at a point now where the issue isn’t if these things aren’t real, the US government says they are, the issue is what are they… I prefer to contribute to the discussion by adding to the effort of finding out, not dismissing reality outright. Something is going on, period. What it is is the part that everyone should be excited about, especially regular visitors/members of a space subreddit lol

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ryanq99 t1_it8fu43 wrote

Do you think anything will actually come out of this study?

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AP-the-RD t1_it8gv60 wrote

This study I’m not too optimistic about but I would love to be proven wrong. I’m more paying attention to the recent passing of the NDAA that includes language related to the UAP reports due to congress as well as provisions for whistleblowers to come forward with immunity in regards to legacy black programs involved in crash retrieval’s and possibly in possession of material that may be of interest. Again, I’m no expert but to me that’s where the golden ticket is, compartmentalized black budget programs that prominent members of the intelligence agencies have purported to exist over the years. Just my opinion.

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Abababababbbb t1_itab52u wrote

woman astronauts ride 20 hours wearing a diaper to threaten with a gun a love rival.

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ryanq99 t1_itabfns wrote

This looks like what happens when you keep pressing the suggested words on an iPhone

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vibrunazo t1_itao526 wrote

> Some of these guys are highly trained, highly educated

That has a value of exactly zero to the scientific method. Eye witness testimony is unreliable regardless of whose testimony it is. That's science 101.

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ryanq99 t1_itap5zv wrote

It’s impossible to come to a conclusion because there’s almost zero evidence. What we do have though, are a few instances of unusual phenomenon that we can’t explain.

Most people who say they have seen ufos are crazy. Some could be intelligent in some areas but most are crazy.

There are real accounts of unidentified objects that seem to surpass our understandings of movement or physics. David Fravor and 3 other people witnessed something that is still not explained yet. We don’t know what it is.

And it’s not only eye witness testimony. It’s cameras and sensors.

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vibrunazo t1_itaqth8 wrote

> It’s cameras and sensors.

And none of them have ever proven the data to be nothing alien or supernatural. End of story. Come back when you have better evidence.

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ryanq99 t1_itbf58p wrote

When did I ever say aliens? I was very clear that there is not enough evidence to come to a conclusion? Come back when you can read.

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