LiveComfortable3228 t1_j67jec5 wrote
No offense but I find this proposition super naïve.
AI (specially AGI) will replace jobs by the millions. Billions probably. This will further (significantly) exacerbate today's wealth gap by downgrading billions of ppl whose jobs have been replaced by AGI and making an even smaller uber-wealthy class who controls the AGIs and related tech.
Any idea of "wealth redistribution" seems ludicrous to me. Why is it not happening already? Musk, Jeff, Mark, Bill, Sergei, etc own trillions of dollars. Why aren't they redistributing now?
It is not the job of non for profit to provide UBI to the billions. No, UBI (if at all) will come from governments. Since a very large number of people will not have jobs, tax collection will drop. The answer is simple, either there's a tax on AGI or billions go into poverty. I tell you, when billions go into poverty, things dont generally end well.
Reality is that this is an unprecedented moment in our planet. I dont buy the analogy of the industrial revolution and how people adapt and find new types of jobs, etc. Yes, that will happen to some extent (benefiting very few ppl). But most people are NOT cut out or have the skills to be a AI data scientists or similar. We are literally walking into uncharted territory affecting the very foundations of our civilization. I'm not kidding or trying to dramatize things. This is unlike anything that we have ever seen and it will require a massive change in the way we structure our society, as well as a massive safety net for everyone.
Worst of all...its coming in super fast, and probably much sooner than anticipated.
Desperate_Food7354 t1_j67pv3h wrote
Everyone would lose their jobs, even the business owners, AGI would do a better job than any human at anything. The $ is only of value between humans, not to an AGI.
seeking99 t1_j6a9enj wrote
Business owners don't really have a job in the first place; if the company turns a profit and their ownership isn't somehow revoked then they have no reason to quit, even if any work like management or executive decision-making is done by AGI for them.
Since the businesses are the private property of the owners they hold the right to any value that comes of the company's functionings, no matter how little work the owner contributes vs the AGI or how important they are.
ipatimo t1_j68tthw wrote
No one will need AI data scientists after AGI arrival. But concerning taxes, jobs would not disappear, they would be replaced by AGI. Goods and services would be produced even at higher scale and taxes would come to the governments in greater amount than before. The problem is that "no taxation without representation" one can read also backwards.
TheKing01 OP t1_j6958wz wrote
> taxes would come to the governments in greater amount than before
I'm skeptical of this. See the last part of my post.
LiveComfortable3228 t1_j6b1bsd wrote
Hello? If all those jobs go to AGI, how are people supposed to support themselves? You will have a massive shift from taxable income (people working) to companies having additional profits and paying less tax on those profits. Basically, corporations getting richer and government and people getting poorer.
The thing is that UBI is not the answer either. Work generates income but also gives you a sense of purpose and accomplishment. A society paid to sit on an apartment watching tiktok videos will collapse quickly, UBI or no UBI.
ipatimo t1_j6c94eo wrote
Of course it is not guaranteed that companies will pay all that taxes, it's government job to force them. My point was, that in this situation there would be money even if everyone lose their job. The problem of wealth distribution is still to be solved, but we can see how it can be made in countries like Germany. There people are considered to have a right to have all necessary to live. Of course for now it is only minimum: food, clothes, place to live, public utilities. But it's enough to live and many people, who are unable to find a job are living from this money for years. Purpose and accomplishment are important for humans, but is a work, especially a payed work, is the only way to get it? The problem of unhappy people watching tiktok in their apartments can be solved by AI mental health asistant. Now there is basically no access to mental health services for the majority of Earth's population.
TheKing01 OP t1_j68b4f8 wrote
> Any idea of "wealth redistribution" seems ludicrous to me. Why is it not happening already?
Philanthropists like Bill Gates are already doing this on a large scale? 🤔
LiveComfortable3228 t1_j6b0ror wrote
The philanthropy done by Bill Gates and the likes is mostly about lifting people out of poverty and reduce mortality in 3rd world countries. They fund vaccine research, safer nuclear energy research, eradicate preventable diseases and other things such as developing waterless toilets for where there are none today. All very worthy causes which better the lives of millions of people. What he DOESNT do, is pay people a UBI and its unlikely to happen. Why would we depend on billionaires to do this?
This is a government issue, perhaps even a UN issue, given the global scale.
The thing is that if AGI is not taxed (or some other means to fund UBI), society will semi-collapse. Yeah, the big tech companies will make a ton of money initially but if no one can afford to buy their goods and services, it will lead to a vicious cycle that will ultimately end very bad.
Again, I dont buy the analogies with other major disruptions in our history such as the industrial revolution. This affects (sooner or later) everyone. If Intelligence is the commodity being traded, no one is safe.
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