How should the society - right now - adapt to the AI boom?

Submitted by reviedox t3_z7a4zw in singularity

TLDR: is the government capable of adapting us to the world of AI? Is UBI economically feasible? What to do with companies fighting against UBI? Will the AI harm human society / psychology? Will people become addicted to stimulus and abandon hobbies now that it's all AI generated?

This is more of a socioeconomical question, but still very related. The AI revolution is here, right now, the engine's of progress are ramping up to the full speed and we WILL see massive changes in society as soon as 2030, potentially definitely sooner. The problem is, I'm not sure we're prepared or even capable of preparing. That's why I'd like to hear your opinions on this issue(?)

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1) Unemployment - the good ol' reliable when discussing AI. It's no longer just problem of the lower class, but programmers, artists, office workers etc. are now at risk of losing their livelihood. What to do with them? Naturally, welfare is often cited as solution for this, but is it? It will take long time before full automation becomes a thing and for a good while, we might be stuck with half of the population working and the second one unable to get a job.

How to make sure that one half is financially secure to have a good life, while the other one doesn't feel cheated that they still need to work? Is it economically viable? Leading me to my second point.

2) Economy - is it economically possible to socially secure most or all of the population through welfare? Not very knowledgeable about it, but my main strife is that if little to none worked and we had an equal UBI provided through corporate taxation, how would that work? Wouldn't that be just company giving half of their profit to the people just so they could get it back through sales?

I don't know how to describe this thought of mine, but it seems like it would offer little growth opportunities for the industry? In a worst case scenario, the companies are adopting AI for the sake of saving money, they will fight tooth and nail to stop government increasing corporate taxation, then what?

3) Society - finally, what are your thoughts on the risk of AI being used for identity theft, scamming, misinformation, perversity or blackmail? Additionally, do you think that access to unlimited AI-generated content and stimulus could have harmful effect on human psychology?

Sounds dumb, but I suddenly remembered Wall-E where the humans had all needs provided for by the robots and effectively turned them into stimulus seeking slobs with no motivation.

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That would be all from me, sorry for the long wall of text and thank you if you've read it all the way through to here. It's just I recently started to think too much about the whole future of AI thing and wanted to release my thoughts somehow.

Tried to look into other threads, but got frustrated that most of the answers were that the AI will lead us into an utopian world, but not how the path into there will look like.

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datwunkid t1_iy5nyph wrote

It'll always be 20 years away in mainstream public's head until it is right in front of our faces.

I predict entire fields will be mostly automated very sporadically, the first will make major headlines, until all of a sudden it goes into freefall.

No actual good UBI discussion will happen until a lot of very preventable unemployment suffering already occurred.

Society will eventually adapt to AI scams and related crimes, but a large vulnerable population of mostly elderly will be hit, major legislation and financial regulations will be reactionary to these after a year or two of chaos to curb the scams.

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Bierculles t1_iy830wg wrote

Just imagine a single AI making highly optimized scam calls in the thousands every day.

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NTIASAAHMLGTTUD t1_iyaf64q wrote

>It'll always be 20 years away in mainstream public's head until it is right in front of our faces.

nail on head

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cy13erpunk t1_iy7ae8y wrote

i dont know necessarily HOW it will happen

but our future is arguably going to continue to follow a dystopian path for awhile , AI notwithstanding as it is atm

basically cyberpunk is our future right now , but to what degree i cant say ; a lot of famous sci-fi is much more advanced in very narrow ways , ie blade runner has interstellar android wars and flying cars , but no internet

our future is going to be weirder than most envisioned , as is usually the case ; but i dont see the powerful/corrupt being kicked from their ivory towers anytime soon , their propaganda still has the masses completely beguiled

the poor and/or ignorant are going to be the grease for the machine as always , and those who can figure out how to leverage new and disruptive technologies to their advantage will be able to climb up the ladder , just as we've seen in recent decades ; but the majority of common plebs/idiots/morons will just be unneeded/wasted labor , so ya there is going to have to be UBI or riots/gangs/etc will increase

all of the govs/banks are in the process of trying to rollout their CBDCs , and most peasants are just going to do whatever they are told ; but a majority AI guided economy would most likely want to use a Bitcoin based money system as it would not need the inflationary/corrupt aspects of centralized gov fiat , ie the AI has no need for greed like human politicians/bankers do

TLDR - change was coming , change is here , those that can adapt will be able to survive and/or thrive , those that cannot will suffer

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musing2020 t1_iy6lbep wrote

We have corporate profits at an all-time high ( in 2022). It is hard to imagine that the corporations profiting from this development will share the profits with the society. All the AI predictions mentioned by various posts in this sub will more likely be under the control of elites. How is this development going to bridge the gap between the classes?

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savedposts456 t1_iy8cv5j wrote

One of the few things the elites fear is widespread violence breaking out. If it becomes apparent that 50% of the population may miss a few meals and start tearing everything down, they may be willing to start a UBI. Maybe. We’ll see.

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visarga t1_iy91piz wrote

> All the AI predictions mentioned by various posts in this sub will more likely be under the control of elites.

You can download a model, but you can't download a Google or FaceBook. AI needs less resources to run locally, instead of a whole data centre it needs just a desktop computer in case of Stable Diffusion or an expensive multi-GPU box in case of a model like GPT-3.

The moral - by running on people's hardware AI could be serving us instead of the big corporations. AI will empower everyone with new skills, lowering the entry barrier to various fields. That is a democratising influence.

I think Google and FB right now are scared of the replacement of manual browsing with chat dialogue agents. If those agents are controlled by the users it means no advertising will be possible anymore. Your own agent will be helpful and polite, will separate the spam from the ham and serve you just what you need without all the crap.

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musing2020 t1_iyb99m4 wrote

Your points are well intentioned and are dependent upon individual abilities to create utilities using freely available AI models. A bit calibration is required when we want to generalize the abilities across the board.

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Superduperbals t1_iy7fdc6 wrote

History will repeat itself. Like with any revolution worth writing about, first AI will produce unprecedented wealth and power which will only be enjoyed by the elite few. The inequality will escalate to the point of violence when the masses rise up and start chopping heads. The road to an AGI powered utopia will be paved in the blood of todays technocratic elite.

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Rook2135 t1_iy7m9gd wrote

You don’t think the elites think about that? There’s a very good chance that by then they’d leverage AI technology so much in the direction of military power. It could get to the point where if they have the capabilities to hoard all the wealth with AI then also protect it. This is why it’s so important for people to defend their human right to a free life today via legislature.

But quite frankly most people are too low IQ, or just ignorant imo to understand the potential for Ai

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SWATSgradyBABY t1_iy6i0ry wrote

There will be upheaval beyond what any American younger than 80 has ever seen. But the chaos will be from workers fighting for socialism while the media will be giving a false narrative designed to gin up support for UBI.

The hope of the elite will be to stay in control via some form of oligarchy disguised as representative govt. They will use UBI to do this. Workers will be fighting for socialism. It will be violent.

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bigquestions59 t1_iy6tetz wrote

The world is MASSIVE, implementing change with AI will take a long time

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TheHamsterSandwich t1_iy5m42h wrote

I'm calling it now, nothing will be different in 2030. The difference will be that the date says 2030 instead of 2022. The fact that governments aren't trying to do anything about artificial intelligence right now sort of proves we aren't on the cusp of something revolutionary.

We aren't going to be seeing mass unemployment utopia any time soon. It's at least a few decades away.

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VanceIX t1_iy6eeeq wrote

The government is always slow to react to technological advancements, it’s just how things are. Governments tend to be reactionary rather than precautionary. Just look at the state of the internet today: governments around the world have only started seriously regulating things in the last decade or so, and that to mixed success.

Even then, there’s already signs that the USA government at least is leveraging AI more and more, just that those applications are obscured for national security purposes. The NSA, CIA, and FBI doubtlessly have tracking and profiling applications using AI, just like China does. The military has incorporated many AI technologies into weapon systems and fighter aircraft.

I do agree that 2030 likely won’t be that far off from 2022, just saying the lack of action by the government isn’t really predicting anything.

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Mokebe890 t1_iy5sq9c wrote

Interesting take. What if they just dont focus on this besides military possibilities? Literally they only care about being the strongest. Somehow following everything that happens its bold to say nothing will change. If things change faster, and indeed we're developing faster and faster, I dont see why wouldnt we have massive changes.

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reviedox OP t1_iy5mvt6 wrote

I understand, I didn't meant full automation by 2030 and utopia by 2040, just that some fields could change a lot by then, but I'll admit that I wrote it bit too dramatically, sorry for that

I know the government isn't doing anything, which is why I asked as it worries me that the the government might not be capable of acting fast in case of rapid AI development

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TheDonVancity t1_iy6atly wrote

Honestly I can’t tell either, but I mean hey I was thinking about the art generators and how pretty much what that means is all artists in the world pretty much got automated by that one tool so who knows 🤔

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cy13erpunk t1_iy7al0v wrote

XD

keeping you head in the sand eh?

let us know how that works out for ya in 2030

becuz obvs gov has your best interests at heart and is always ahead of the curve XD

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tatleoat t1_iy6j6o0 wrote

"Just don't fucking kill each other" is all I can ask

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cy13erpunk t1_iy7ai2t wrote

im fine with the majority killing each other

just dont kill me or my friends or maybe anyone in this reddit thread XD

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XPao t1_iy61wvk wrote

This is not the boom yet.

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DukkyDrake t1_iy6b20g wrote

I think you will have to wait for attrition to clear the field of the bulk of pre 1980s generations before you have a shot at a UBI in the US, perhaps ~2050s.

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Future_Believer t1_iy6yh94 wrote

First off, there is not actually any thing you can point to and say, "son,that there is the gub'mint". There are of course, around the world, millions of humans who participate in whatever scheme of governance the locals will accept. As such, your opening TL:DR question could be quite reasonably asked of people. I know it sounds like I am just being pedantic but it is relevant to the way one thinks about these things. It is people that will have to adapt to the development and deployment of Manufactured Intelligence.

Unemployment is coming for everyone. IMNSHO that is a good thing. However, humanity has a long history of increasing the population as a source of workers. Once a given culture surpasses the need for additional workers, it usually results in some manipulative powerhungry ass figuring out a way to make money from keeping the poor people having children.

The economy is what those manipulative powerhungry asses are trying to control. But the truth is once robots and computers are doing all of the energy generation, energy distribution, research, farming, manufacturing etc etc, there is no NEED for an economy. There will be no good reason for anything to cost anything. It may take a while but eventually this will be obvious to anyone wiling to think about it.

The societal issues you mention suggest to me that you are not thinking about the Intelligence in charge as being intelligent. Also, theft becomes ever more rare as we get closer to the economy I suggest we are inevitably heading for. (unless we destroy humanity first but, that will eliminate theft as well.)

Right now we need to figure out a way to describe the coming future in such a way that is not only not scary to the hoi polloi but is actually desirable. Unfortunately, I have no real ideas to offer on that.

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InvisibleWrestler t1_iyavr0w wrote

I have no understanding of economics. I've limited understanding of ownership of resources. People who already own infrastructure and land etc will continue to charge money for its use. I'm probably wrong or confused coz I don't understand how value generation truly works.

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Future_Believer t1_iyberxj wrote

I don't think you have a significant lack of understanding. If you lack anything it is the ability to consider those things in a different context, i.e. the context of the probable future.

Of course, there is a very good chance that the future will be something other that what I or Roddenberry or Kurtzweil envision. If the Manufactured Intelligence my prognostications are predicated upon fails to be brought into existence, I will be laughably wrong. OTOH if a couple of things happen more aggressively than my intentionally conservative guesstimates, I will be laughably wrong in the other direction.

I did not predict the advent and take up of mobile phones/computers. The world wide web was a bit of a surprise to me. Hell, I thought few people needed or would spring for a color monitor. I'm guessing. I hope it turns out to be an educated guess I can't advise betting your lunch money on what I think is coming.

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gangstasadvocate t1_iy7pxwm wrote

Not a problem in my mind, I like taking drugs and having work done for me

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naossoan t1_iy9j6xy wrote

Everyone who isn't already rich right now, or will have at minimum several million in the bank by 2030 is basically screwed.

The economy isn't ready for mass adoption of AI taking over jobs.

The government isn't ready for it either.

Legislation is not even being considered or thought about seriously enough right now to even have the precursor to a solution.

UBI with current econimies cannot work, there's not enough money being brought in by taxes to pay for it. People argue this all the time but they literally cannot do basic math.

It would take close to 800 BILLION dollars per year to give every adult in Canada $2000 per month, which is well below minimum wage, and well below the cost of living for a single person. That's close to 3 times the current annual tax revenue. That kind of money isn't going to just materialize from nowhere, even if you take it all from the richest people and corporations in Canada it doesn't even begin to make up the difference.

Call me a doomer but I believe by the time I'm 50 I will basically be living in poverty with no possible avenues for me to not be in poverty due to automation of nearly everything and no societal safety nets being put in place. I am in a decent place right now with my vocation because what I do can't directly be automated, but it COULD be replaced by a new technology, or by a different way of doing what I do. I do believe that could happen by the time I'm 50, putting me out of work because what I do is highly specialized. I've been studying and working on Web Development on the side because it's interesting and I enjoy building things, and pays well right now if I decide to try to make a second income from that on the side, but that is even more susceptible to AI automation. Soooo.....

My head is pretty much 80% AI is going to ruin everyone who isn't already rich's lives, 20% it will free everyone from work and provide a high quality of living for everyone.

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Business_Royal_201 t1_iy6wapf wrote

I think many jobs will go, but business owners who use AI may survive. So maybe learn to hustle online using AI like some are doing, to help you make it through the transition.

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Brangible t1_iy93r6j wrote

T2 - Judgement Day has arrived

What character will you be?

I want to be one of the extras that gets his knee cap shot off by AI.

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ihopeimnotdoomed t1_iya4bz0 wrote

Please excuse the vulgarity but I think this sums it up nicely. If everyone has a big dick, then no one had a big dick. We have to figure out how to get past that.

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OsakaWilson t1_iy7m2pm wrote

How should the tail wag the dog?

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