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1

Wagamaga OP t1_itug62v wrote

It’s the vitamin that we get from the sun, yet despite its ample availability, one in three Australian adults still suffer from mild, moderate or severe vitamin D deficiency.

Now, new research from the University of South Australia gives strong evidence that vitamin D deficiency is associated with premature death, prompting calls for people to follow healthy vitamin D level guidelines.

Published in Annals of Internal Medicine, the study found that the more severe the vitamin D deficiency, the greater the risk of mortality.

Vitamin D is an important nutrient that helps maintain good health and keep our bones and muscles strong and healthy.

First author and UniSA PhD candidate, Josh Sutherland, says while vitamin D has been connected with mortality, it has been challenging to establish causal effects.

“While severe vitamin D deficiency is rarer in Australia than elsewhere in the world, it can still affect those who have health vulnerabilities, the elderly, and those who do not acquire enough vitamin D from healthy sun exposure and dietary sources,” Sutherland says

https://www.newswise.com/articles/vitamin-d-deficiency-linked-to-premature-death

61

uzes_lightning t1_itugb2o wrote

So we're just supposed to gobble 5000 i.u. of fish oil every day?

−14

chriswhoppers t1_ituh6c7 wrote

Replying to uzes_lightning (#235,972)

Or a new adduct of vitamin D can be created like elephant tranquilizer or meth, that is 100x stronger than fentynal or amphetamine. Then even people with strong deficiency can get what they acquire. Just don't do too much or calcium stones might form and various other health problems associated with too much vitamine D

3

chriswhoppers t1_ituhswz wrote

Replying to uzes_lightning (#235,972)

Also if you want to get freaky. The industry standard could be easily set to include more vitamins in food, and everyone would just get a balanced amount throughout a day without even noticing

12

turtlenips69 t1_itui7b8 wrote

Should I be taking a vitamin D supplement?

26

AOERN t1_ituoh6u wrote

That's good news! I should start smoking again too.

−14

tholdawa t1_itupzf3 wrote

Replying to [deleted] (#236,501)

The method used (mendelian randomization) uses only the variation in the exposure, in this case vitamin d, that is predicted by very specific genes. This variation is arguably unrelated to later lifestyle choices.

5

moneymachinegoesbing t1_iturdmj wrote

this is so important, and critically under appreciated. but it’s not just Vitamin D. well, it is, but our individual body’s absorption of Vitamin D plays a critical role. the microbiota is responsible for processing the vitamin D we consume, but cannot do so unless 1) the microbiota is healthy, and 2) the microbiota has the fiber, magnesium (and in the process tributyrate) to metabolize. great share, this is extremely important information.

21

jah05r t1_ituuz0v wrote

Translation: go outside, people!

Go for a walk, get some exercise, and let the sun do its thing with vitamin D.

71

jah05r t1_itv1l2z wrote

Replying to [deleted] (#238,008)

Oh, that is total nonsense. People today are much, much healthier than they were in our Hunter-gatherer state. But that doesn’t mean we don’t have room for improvement or that every change made resulted in improved health.

55

grumble11 t1_itv2mov wrote

Replying to jah05r (#238,460)

We are because we don’t get hurt as much, have better medical care and have more reliable food access, and have better support systems to keep people alive in extreme old age who would normally age naturally died. Those are technological adaptations, not lifestyle ones

−6

rosesandtherest t1_itv31yi wrote

Just in, people that can afford to spend more days relaxing on a sunny beach live longer than low wage workers who work at night and sleep at day.

18

jah05r t1_itv35hi wrote

Replying to grumble11 (#238,565)

They are absolutely lifestyle adoptions. The widespread adoption of sanitation practices (especially clean drinking water) is the single most important lifestyle adoption we have made. Farming is a close second, which has both increased the food supply consistency and resulted in less dangerous behaviors.

20

bg370 t1_itv38jx wrote

Replying to [deleted] (#238,008)

Huge numbers of people died from vitamin D deficiency, often during childbirth. As Africans moved into Europe the darkest ones died and the lightest ones lived because of too little vitamin D. Eventually we got white people. Once they hit Scandinavia they went kinda albino in order to get enough sun - blonde hair and blue eyes.

2

redditaccount71987 t1_itv3rto wrote

Replying to jah05r (#237,725)

So there are a number of things in addition to lack of sunlight which contribute to low vit D. Folk with darker skin color tend to have lower amounts additionally this deficiency is noted in certain medical conditions. If lifestyle can not resolve the deficiency supplementation is often advised.

35

redditaccount71987 t1_itv3zuo wrote

Replying to turtlenips69 (#236,221)

Your doctor will check it if you think you are having problems or have things that may lead to it. I think mine was like 13 upon testing megadoses it to 18. Got another megadose but was unable to take it due to current situation.

2

grumble11 t1_itv46ee wrote

Replying to jah05r (#238,631)

Sure which is all technology. Sanitation isn’t a lifestyle change.

Farmers also weren’t exactly healthier - the average size of a farmer shrank materially versus hunters and signs of malnutrition were obvious and frequent - but they were more reliably able to access calories over time so it won out. Do you believe that you are unable to access calories now?

Spend a large amount of time outdoors, moderate exercise for hours a day, whole unprocessed food you could find a thousand years ago, sleep adequately and early.

−9

shanvanvook t1_itv4q8z wrote

On the other hand obese people have lower vitamin d levels so there is that issue.

3

Wut-doo-yew-meen t1_itv5rj6 wrote

What’s the required amount of vitamin D? If you took a walk outside for 30 minutes a day would you possibly be deficient? I live in the Northeast and people complain about how gloomy it is for half the year, but I still go outside in the winter to do things that are fun into do chores like walk, the dog and such.

I I don’t wanna go get tested because it would probably cost me unnecessary dollars.

2

jah05r t1_itv6ct3 wrote

Replying to grumble11 (#238,773)

Sanitation was absolutely a lifestyle change. Things like washing your hands and bathing regularly were nowhere close to standard practice until quite recently.

And the reason it seems like farmers shrank in size is because so many more of them lived into old age. You no longer had to be the biggest or strongest to survive, and the extraordinary steps that Hunter-gatherers took to control population size (aka infanticide) were no longer necessary because enough food was available for a larger population.

Do you honestly think calories were more accessible to Hunter-gatherers than they are now?

10

Charliethebrit t1_itv9mgn wrote

Wasn't there research indicating and a reduction in vitamin D lead to an increased risk of death, but then it was shown that it's not that the vitamin D was the cause of the increased risk, rather it was a proxy for people who were unable to protect themselves from covid because they desperately needed to work?

edit: I'm looking for sources currently, and seeing a lot on the poor Covid prognosis predictions with low vitamin D and a handful of papers indicating that poverty tends to lead to vitamin deficiencies, but not something that connects the two. Additional sources from folks that can clarify would be appreciated.

1

natie29 t1_itvaisp wrote

Wow. I have 1.1 metres of small bowel left and have to drink LOADS of supplements to ensure I’m getting enough calories and vitamins a day. Better start getting those vit D tabs in again too. Had them over Covid as it was shown to help that but stopped taking them.

9

Kakashisith t1_itve88o wrote

That doesn`t make me to love tanning. I still cover myself from that evil shining thing.

3

SolarParasite t1_itvfvs1 wrote

Wouldn't any vitamin deficiency be statistically linked to lower lifespan when averaged out?

10

jah05r t1_itvj15q wrote

Replying to Andydan777 (#240,349)

Mostly because everything from availability of calories to quality of sanitation to quality of shelter to near-universal vaccination in today’s society is leaps and bounds better than it was in Hunter-gatherer days.

4

jl_theprofessor t1_itvj30l wrote

I did a little digging to see if my diet had enough Vitamin D in it. Turns out, the three eggs I eat every day as a part of my salad does indeed have more than enough Vitamin D to meet my daily recommended limits! Makes me a little happy since I don't get to spend as much time outside as some other people.

3

trbotwuk t1_itvkvgn wrote

how much to take is a question that can only be answered by getting the vitamin D levels tested frequently.

2

shamanbaptist t1_itvkzfr wrote

A while back I began having issues with (it’s hard to describe but I’ll call it) visual spatial relations. Like grabbing something in my peripheral vision or putting something down avoiding hitting an obstruction or another object. Found out I had low vitamin D. I am taking a supplement and when I don’t, the symptoms return. Very strange. I think we don’t know everything that vitamins do for us.

4

Wut-doo-yew-meen t1_itvp73u wrote

Replying to MrsWilson78 (#241,365)

Thanks for the info.

I guess what I am saying is I can drink 6-8 glasses of water per day and know that I am hydrating correctly. I don’t need to get a test to see if I am hydrated.

Is there a rule of thumb like that for vitamin D?

Edit: I don’t want to spend $125-$175 to find out I am as fine as I feel.

3

senorkose t1_itvqz7t wrote

Very interested in this topic especially after moving to the PNW from Texas.

My understanding is that analyses from that big VITAL trial showed that vitamin d supplementation did not prevent cancer, cardiovascular disease, or falls; reduce atrial fibrillation, migraine frequency, age related macular degeneration, or knee pain; or improve cognitive function. An ancillary study from VITAL earlier this year also showed that it did not reduce fractures either.

So, from what I gather - vitamin d supplementation has not made a big impact but vitamin d deficiency seems to be linked to a lot of bad stuff… not to mention it may help (and prob can’t hurt) if you live in the cloudy PNW.

of that ancillary study of the VITAL trial in NEJM earlier this year showed no important health benefits from Vit D supplementation in the gen population of older adults,

3

BoOtto t1_itvvgk0 wrote

Replying to Demonyx12 (#239,629)

The answer is probably yes, but it should probably be no, since vitamin D supplements have no data backing up their benefits, but they are still widely recommended. ”Overkill” by Paul A Offit for one covers this quite well.

2

BoOtto t1_itvvr6g wrote

Replying to Great_White_Samurai (#237,431)

Vitamin D deficiency is known to cause problems, but randomized trials of supplements show no benefit of giving people vitamin D. It’s more likely a correlation not a causation.

−4

Snoo_5343 t1_itvwr8b wrote

Replying to [deleted] (#240,159)

Alsof worth mentioning that the link netwerk vitamine D and health has been established many times. In Covid as Well. Yet taking vit D tablets has bever been proven helpfull. People with high vit D levels go out more exercise more have a healthy gut biome... Taking Vit D may be useful but it is not the magical answer to everything

2

FjorgVanDerPlorg t1_itvy8uj wrote

Replying to jah05r (#237,725)

Also supplement with vit D3 oil if you are a night owl. A few drops, absorbed under the tongue was part of my daily "night shift ritual". Tablets and absorbtion through the gut is terrible for vit D, but sublingially (under the tongue) works quite well.

Also to those thinking they get enough sunlight "indoors", windows block the UV light spectrum responsible for generating vit D, you don't get any unless it's direct sunlight.

11

bellyfuzz t1_itw06fx wrote

just recently was diagnosed as Vitamin D defecient...they have me on 50000 units a week with a once a week dose for 3 months. i had experieced a couple of serious dizzy spells at work which prompted my doc to order the blood work. Remains to be seen if this will help...only 3 weeks in

1

jwf239 t1_itw5ykx wrote

It can legit wreck your life. I thought I had MS for years. Took like 6 neurologists before someone finally thought to check my vitamin D level and it was like a 2. Dr said she had never seen one so low.

3

amadeus2490 t1_itw6jeh wrote

Replying to Wagamaga (#235,949)

> one in three Australian adults still suffer from mild, moderate or severe vitamin D deficiency.

Which is probably because Australians are, for the most part, genetically English and they're fair skinned. They can't handle a lot of direct sun light, so they're covering up and wearing sun screen.

20

Demonyx12 t1_itw89vq wrote

Replying to BoOtto (#242,196)

I'll agree with that, especially since you admit that the hard evidence for supplements are not as strong as the #MehmetOz crowd would have you believe. (outside of corner cases)

PS - By corner cases I mean specific deficiencies, diseases, disorders, pregnancy, etc. Because most of the time for otherwise healthy individuals supplements don't do much. There is a lot of good science behinds this despite not being absolutely completely settled.

TIL While useful for those with dietary deficiencies, multivitamins offer no real benefit to the majority of the population. The U.S. Preventive Services Task Force found no clear evidence that consuming multivitamins "made them healthier in any way." https://www.reddit.com/r/todayilearned/comments/yghx80/til_while_useful_for_those_with_dietary/

0

ToadMead t1_itwe0j0 wrote

I have red hair, and i was told that red headed people produce their own vitamin d. I wonder if thats actually true

0

steinbergergppro t1_itwfkxt wrote

Replying to jah05r (#237,725)

Problem is then your trading one health problem for another. More sun exposure might increase you Vitamin D levels, but it's also increasing your risk of developing cancer as well as speeding up photoaging.

The safest all around solution is to continue proper sun protection with clothing, sunscreen, etc. and supplement your Vitamin D through your diet.

On the same subject, almost everyone in Western civilization is also Vitamin B12 deficient because of the highly sanitary conditions our food and water is prepared. So people should supplement Vitamin B12 as well.

15

FreydisTit t1_itwh2by wrote

Replying to bg370 (#238,641)

Just to add, the mesolithic hunter gatherers of Scandinavia and Europe had dark skin for around 40k years or more after their migration out of Africa. There wasn't a need for them to adapt their melanin to colder climates because they ate a diet rich in vitamin D3, creating a shortcut that doesn't require sun exposure. They consumed fish, the livers of large mammals, and mushrooms. They were also lactose intolerant like their African ancestors. They did have the mutations for light eyes.

It wasn't until migrations to the area during the neolithic period that farming was introduced to this area, and hunter gatherers lived with farming societies for a thousand years or so before the complete adoption of agriculture. These migrations, along with climate change, the loss of hunter gatherer diet, genetic mutations for lactose tolerance, mutations regarding immunity, and sexual selection, led to lighter skin, which just happened in the last 4k years or so. Archeological evidence coupled with DNA show that vitamin D deficiency did become a problem during this transition.

I'm glad you brought up vitamin D deficiency, because it is really a problem, especially for those with darker skin near the equator. They have fewer natural sources of D3, and some cultural and religious practices in these areas lead to women, who need Vitamin D the most for bone health because of estrogen, to suffer from vitamin D deficiency in the highest numbers. The children in these areas are disproportionately affected as well.

2

FreydisTit t1_itwk8nk wrote

Replying to natie29 (#239,600)

Make sure it's D3. I had a vitamin D deficiency really bad and was prescribed D2, which still required sun. I didn't start feeling better until taking a daily D3 for a few months.

2

FreydisTit t1_itwl70j wrote

Replying to moneymachinegoesbing (#237,302)

My gastro didn't inform me that the medication he prescribed for GERD would inhibit vitamin D absorption in the gut, and he was my gastro for almost 20 years. I wasn't screened for vit d deficiency until I was 40, and my NP caught the deficiency. I should have been screened much sooner.

5

urionje t1_itwmibd wrote

Replying to rosesandtherest (#238,619)

Point taken, but consider street sweepers, farm laborers, lower-skilled construction workers, etc. The list goes on, you don’t have to be relaxing to be in the sun. It is better though!

4

FreydisTit t1_itwmnir wrote

Replying to Kakashisith (#240,060)

I feel you. I was taught from a young age to stay out of the sun as much as possible and wear sunscreen at all times to prevent aging, and sure enough I was diagnosed with a severe vitamin D deficiency. Now I go outside during peak sun and expose my back (largest surface) for about 10 minutes. I also take D3 supplements, which is a better version for those of us who don't like sun.

3

FreydisTit t1_itwn2fv wrote

Replying to shamanbaptist (#240,889)

I agree there is more to know, and before I was diagnosed with a vitamin D deficiency, I went to my ophthalmologist for a peripheral vision test because I was having the issues you are describing.

5

rockmasterflex t1_itwphi3 wrote

Why aren’t we just adding it to water these days?

1

FreydisTit t1_itwpzpw wrote

Replying to senorkose (#241,611)

According to this rebuttal of the study, only 12.7% of the participants tested for vitamin D levels prior to the study (61%) were baseline deficient in Vitamin D. So 39% of participants weren't tested for baseline levels of vitamin D. Also, they did not account for body weight, other Vitamin D supplementation, sunlight exposure, or clothing coverage.

I think the Vital study was examining vitamin D supplementation in general. Not a great design.

3

Numismatists t1_itwr1t7 wrote

Kinda makes me wonder why we raised entire generations on TV and Internet.

1

amadeus2490 t1_itwrizi wrote

Replying to RetirementIsSweet (#243,977)

Yes, but this research is showing us that a lot of them arent getting their RDA there anyways.

Life has also evolved - in the past couple of years especially - for everyone to be indoors, nearly 24/7. Reddit is full of people saying they haven't had to leave the house at all for weeks, because of working and studying at home, and getting food and supplies from Doordash and amazon.

1

Good_nuff t1_itwrr4f wrote

Wouldn’t a severe deficiency in any vitamin lead to premature death?

3

DrDumDums t1_itwsjys wrote

Replying to Wagamaga (#235,949)

For all the people in this thread saying they now need vitamin D supplements, please read:

“But it's not essential to take a supplement. And overall, aside from some high-risk groups, most people do not need a supplement. The high-risk groups include patients in nursing homes who may have restricted diets and limited time out of doors. For people with malabsorption conditions such as Crohn's disease, celiac disease, post–gastric bypass surgery, and those with osteoporosis who are on medications for osteoporosis, it's still quite reasonable to prescribe calcium and vitamin D. Recommendations for vitamin D in the generally healthy population really should focus on a healthy diet. The United States has a fortified food supply. Vitamin D is added to many foods, dairy products, and cereals, as well as beverages. Natural sources of vitamin D include fatty fish and wild mushrooms.”

source

17

Rankled_Barbiturate t1_itwy4q3 wrote

The study says causal.... But couldn't it easily be correlational?

For example: The more active I am and able to get outside, the more vitamin d I get. If I'm lying in a bed sick I'm not getting much vitamin d if at all.

So something like exercise/being healthy initially could explain the results rather than being specific to vitamin d....?

2

bishpa t1_itwykq1 wrote

Replying to amadeus2490 (#243,616)

Also, apparently the Vitamin D that our skin makes absorbs slowly into our bodies over time. Bathing daily washes it away before it can be effectively absorbed. According to my kids’ pediatrician, anyway.

0

Redaxe77 t1_itx1pow wrote

Replying to rosesandtherest (#238,619)

Yeah that seems like a major confounding factor - people that are healthier probably exercise and go out doors more. If you have a chronic illness or a physical disability or difficulty in walking (e.g. arthritis) of course you have worse health....

1

cymalik t1_itx5rs2 wrote

Replying to Any_Monitor5224 (#236,577)

Definitely ask your doctor first, sometimes you may need a real opinion rather than asking redditors for it. I mean I understand that people here would want to help, but for health stuff, I believe that a doctor's visit should be warranted.

4

mom2mermaidboo t1_itxnrzv wrote

A woman I know is am MD who worked at an ICU ( intensive care unit) in a big US hospital.

She said 72% of the ICU patients with Covid-19 were deficient in Vitamin D.

1

DrLeftCrRight t1_ity7uvs wrote

Replying to SolarParasite (#240,275)

I'm very, very surprised that no one has pointed this out yet, but low vitamin D is very, very common in obese people, so I feel like this is just another way of saying obese people die sooner.

1

MTL_t3k t1_ity7x39 wrote

All the Vitamin D deficiency research suffers from the same inherent flaw. Vitamin D status can be a proxy for time spent outdoors, which can be a proxy for physical activity, exposure to fresh air, social interaction and other factors with beneficial effects on physical and mental health. Efforts to contril for these effects are fraught with their own inherent flaws.

1

merlinsbeers t1_ityapqp wrote

Replying to DrDumDums (#246,188)

This is not something you can self diagnose.

The ability to absorb vitamin D from the sun and from food declines with age. Most people will need to take large amounts in supplements every day.

Next time you're at the doctor ask to have a vitamin panel done.

Being nutritionally deficient is a dumb way to live.

9

agovinoveritas t1_ityssbn wrote

Replying to merlinsbeers (#252,660)

I did. I was low and checked. Increased it and now I have just a bit on the higher side of normal after 6 months and steady. I have a health condition that limits my absorption and live north of the 25th, which is not the best if you are not white and you don't don't have a lot of sun where you live.

I take 4,000IU with some K2 as well, daily.

Doing a panel is something everyone should do. Since a high % of people are low these days. Ironically, some people may be low in hot weather because they spend most of their time indoors due to air conditioning.

5

wampa-stompa t1_ityzxbx wrote

Replying to Pearl_is_gone (#253,075)

I remember reading it in a study or an official health organization resource but I'd never be able to find it now. Though it did also say that in practice no one ever applies sunscreen thoroughly enough to really prevent vitamin D production.

1

DrDumDums t1_itzucni wrote

Replying to merlinsbeers (#252,660)

How does ability to absorb nutritional vitamin D decline with age? My understanding is that nutritional intake (older people eat less, and less varied foods) generally decreases with age but not absorptive capacity for fat soluble vitamins.

The article I linked specifically advises against large dose vitamin D supplements.

The article also mentions why widespread vitamin d monitoring without a diagnostic indication is a poor idea with limited benefit.

1

merlinsbeers t1_iu02ddo wrote

Replying to DrDumDums (#259,484)

Not sure of why. It just stops being absorbed in the gut as much, and sunshine becomes less effective at producing it even with high exposure.

Doc gave me 10000-unit pills to take weekly for a few weeks then told me to keep taking 2-5000 units a day forever.

D is involved in the chickpea that produce energy, and if I miss several days I can feel it. When I'm on target the fog and malaise go away and I feel like a normal person.

Everyone past their early 40s should get their vitamin panel checked, especially if they feel like they're run-down for no good reason.

I'm not scaling the paywall to verify the article, but if it doesn't talk about the decline with age or it says these dosages are not the medicine for it, then it didn't do its homework.

1

DrDumDums t1_iu06x7e wrote

Replying to merlinsbeers (#260,506)

It’s not a paywall, signup is free. You should read the article, it’s the largest ever study conducted on vitamin D levels. Your opinion does not align with that of the physician researchers who conducted that study.

1

merlinsbeers t1_iu0or67 wrote

Replying to DrDumDums (#261,082)

My time isn't free nor is my email address. They may have asked the wrong questions.

Feel free to use your access to the article to excerpt quotes from it that contradict what I've said.

In particular, they need to say that vitamin D absorption and creation do not decline with age, and that daily doses in the 2000 to 5000-IU range are too high to fix that.

If they don't say that, then my opinion does not conflict with their study, or you didn't understand the study.

And even if they do say that it doesn't mean that they're right and I'm wrong. My opinion conflicts with a lot of "physician researchers" on a lot of topics. Quacks publish, too.

1