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1

Wagamaga OP t1_jcqffup wrote

The football players were both amateur and professional. Sweden was a prominent football nation during the 20th century and many of the players from the top division were competing at the highest international level. However, due to ideals of sportsmanship and amateurism, football clubs in Sweden were not allowed to pay salaries to their football players until the late 1960s.

In recent years, there have been growing concerns about exposure to head trauma in football (soccer) and whether it can lead to increased risk of neurodegenerative disease later in life. A previous study from Scotland suggested that footballers were 3.5 times more likely to develop neurodegenerative disease. Following this evidence, certain footballing associations implemented measures to reduce heading in younger age groups and training settings.

Peter Ueda, assistant professor at Karolinska Institutet, Sweden, says, “While the risk increase in our study is slightly smaller than in the previous study from Scotland, it confirms that elite footballers have a greater risk of neurogenerative disease later in life. As there are growing calls from within the sport for greater measures to protect brain health, our study adds to the limited evidence-base and can be used to guide decisions on how to manage these risks.”

https://scienceblog.com/536992/elite-football-players-are-more-likely-to-develop-dementia/

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Eve-3 t1_jcqh80l wrote

It's almost like repeatedly whacking yourself in the head isn't good for you. Huh. Who'd have guessed.

239

Eve-3 t1_jcqiloe wrote

Replying to IgnoreIfOffended (#2,265,098)

Now you're just being ridiculous. You know when the punch gets to a dangerous level the brain shuts down to protect itself. That's why the boxer loses consciousness, so his brain isn't actually hurt. It's basic science.

Just in case someone thinks I'm that dumb..../s

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willowtr332020 t1_jcqo4ez wrote

To clarify, by 1.5 times more likely, they mean, 9% for footballers, 6% for general population.

Unfortunately, I'd say that's not a significant enough difference from the population (to them) so most people would just accept the risk.

−18

tyler1128 t1_jcr4yu2 wrote

Replying to Eve-3 (#2,265,057)

At least football is better than American football, where the name of the game is to be thrown to the ground and experience TBI. But hey, it's for the sport of it right?

11

tyler1128 t1_jcr867n wrote

Replying to Eve-3 (#2,266,201)

Same. I'm not a sportball person, and I just don't get it. People will criticize me for being very into other things, when it's normal to basically lose your mind with sports. People are weird.

−6

In-Cod-We-Thrust t1_jcsex1i wrote

If makes them near as sick playing it as it makes me watching it they have my sympathy.

−5

Divallo t1_jcsg0im wrote

Do you guys think that playing on artifical turf might be a factor?

I've read that players get more concussions and injuries in general playing on turf vs grass and that turf has some toxicity concerns as well.

Scotland uses turf more than a lot of other countries which could maybe contribute to their higher estimate.

"The highest reported usage of synthetic turf, according to the survey results, occurs in Norway (84%), followed by Ireland and Scotland (81% each) and Moldova (75%)."

https://fieldturf.com/en/articles/detail/esto-survey-majority-of-soccer-coaches-in-europe-prefer-artificial-turf/

24

Tehni t1_jcshggw wrote

Replying to mtcwby (#2,268,474)

High school hits are not as hard as college and pro hits

Somehow I think the sport that tries so hard to cover up it's tbi issue isn't accurately reporting or testing for concussions

16

SignalTrip1504 t1_jcsick3 wrote

Replying to Divallo (#2,268,447)

There was some sort of study on I think a mlb team or something, I forget what it was about but it said with the hot weather in summer the chemicals in the turf get heated up and release into the air as toxins and the players absorb it or breath it in and i think it said these players were getting cancer maybe

12

Jmersh t1_jcsjzcr wrote

I've heard diving can be dangerous.

1

TitaniumGoldAlloyMan t1_jcskg0x wrote

I did one head shot from the goalies shot and never did that again. My head hurt like hell. Can’t imagine if you would do that all the time.

2

Rainstorme t1_jcsl352 wrote

Replying to Eve-3 (#2,265,110)

Most of the harm is actually caused by the repeated blows sustained, not the big ones that get the KO (most don't even end with anyone being knocked out but that's not really important).

For similar reasons, that's why it's actually linemen in American football that have higher rates of CTE when they aren't the ones getting the big hits leading to concussions.

9

Dealan79 t1_jcsopjp wrote

Replying to Eve-3 (#2,265,110)

I have far more faith in your intelligence, random Internet stranger, than I do in ex-Congressmen from Missouri. I am curious as to what Akin actually died of though, since everyone knows that when it's legitimate cancer the body has a way of shutting that down.

6

PeanutBAndJealous t1_jcsyvjb wrote

Funny. I saw the title and thought of insulin resistance in the brain, everyone else says headers

1

Eve-3 t1_jct38cc wrote

Replying to Fit-Anything8352 (#2,267,860)

The form most people use for running/jogging is usually terrible for the knees. Much better than messing up your brain, but not ideal.

I'd guess watersports as the least problematic. I don't recall hearing anything bad about swimming. (Looking forward to the comments saying why I'm wrong so I can learn something new)

4

Lateralis85 t1_jct58f9 wrote

Replying to praetorion999 (#2,266,559)

The evidence from rugby is that soft helmets ("scrum caps" in rugby) aren't effective at preventing injuries through impact, but preventing abrasions and cuts. So for concussions and sub-concussive impacts, scrum caps are of little value but they give the illusion of protection which encourages riskier behaviour.

6

D74248 t1_jct7le4 wrote

Replying to Smacks860 (#2,269,323)

You can find studies that go either way, but the underlying fact is that girl's high school soccer is clearly right up there with high school football. It is a vicious sport, I suspect because of ex-jock fathers pushing their daughters to be aggressive.

Source: Father whose daughter had 2 serious concussions playing high school soccer. I wish that I knew then what I know now. It is not a nice, safe sport.

1

Smacks860 t1_jct9vtl wrote

Replying to D74248 (#2,269,439)

Not trying to be condescending here, but there is a ton of correlation bias going on on your part. I’m not saying soccer isn’t “rough” (I played it my whole life so I do have some anecdotal understanding), but to interpret whatever data you are seeing as - HS girls soccer is rougher/more concussions/etc. than HS football is a huge error (and honestly a good example of how wrongly people interpreted data on a day to day basis for many important topics). There are many variables in play here. For example, it is extremely likely that HS girls tend to report injuries (then leading to diagnoses) at a much higher rate than HS boys / football players. Also, a concussion-causing incident is much more obvious (to a coach / parent / viewer) in soccer than it is in football, again leading to more reporting/diagnoses. Further - why do you think HS girls soccer shows a higher concussion rate than boys HS soccer (I’m assuming that is true, based on whatever reports you are seeing and the fact that you specifically stated “girls HS soccer” vs just “HS soccer”)? It’s the same sport, same rules, although boys soccer is played at a much faster pace (if anything should correlate to higher concussions in boys HS soccer). The answer is because again - statistics don’t always tell the full story.

1

sweetbizil t1_jctajka wrote

Replying to Eve-3 (#2,269,278)

Agreed, jogging is horrible on the joints and long distance low intensity especially. I do a lot of long distance running but I make sure I balance it out and keep my body strong to limit the joint damage. Sprinting does not suffer the same fate however and is very healthy in moderation.

As long as swimming isn’t done indoors I would agree. There is something really unsettling to me about swimming in an indoor pool that smells like a vat of radioactive liquid (to make it “safe” from other peoples’ bodily fluids).

In general, high intensity or low impact (elliptical, biking) training without brain trauma involved is going to be just fine long term imo.

−7

D74248 t1_jctdgad wrote

Replying to Smacks860 (#2,269,540)

The reason boy's soccer reports less injuries is obvious to anyone who has had both boys and girls in high school sports. Football is the prime sport for boys, soccer is the prime sport for girls.

You can google scholar studies yourself. It is unfortunate that you feel so threatened by women.

−3

Lateralis85 t1_jcth3dm wrote

Replying to praetorion999 (#2,269,810)

I am well aware that rugby is not like soccer. I thought about putting something to that effect in my comment but thought it was plainly unnecessary.

My comment still stands. Soft scrum caps (or "helmets") are of no use against impacts, which a header is, but they give the illusion of safety which might encourage more headers and paradoxically make the situation worse.

If there is a problem with headers causing long-term injuries, the solution isn't a "soft helmet". That's the point.

3

108awake- t1_jctko04 wrote

Headers. The should not be allowed

1

wowthatssorude t1_jctz9y5 wrote

Hmmm

Looks like video games are the safest sport. Muahaha

1

uberneoconcert t1_jcunf9s wrote

Replying to D74248 (#2,269,733)

Yes this should be very obvious. I was a D1 scholarship athlete and there was no way I was telling anyone when I got a concussion in high school after they made it clear what the risks were, including field removal.

I got a neurologist and am on multiple migraine medications in my late 30s.

2

WillCode4Cats t1_jcvbdxx wrote

Replying to ThePopKornMonger (#2,269,813)

[mTBI = mild traumatic brain injury i.e., concussion]

Won’t make too much of a difference, I imagine.

You can receive a mTBI from a hit to the chest. No direct contact to the head is even required.

Think of the brain like an egg. You can scramble and egg in its shell if you shake it hard enough back and forth. No need to “hit” the shell at all.

Another similar example is why soldiers can receive concussions from explosions without hitting their heads.

mTBI’s can (mostly) be mitigated by neck stabilization, but that comes with it’s own issues and impracticalities — won’t work in most sports really.

However, the brain cannot be completely stabilized inside the skull. So, mTBI’s cannot be 100% avoided regardless of the equipment used.

2

SnooPuppers1978 t1_jcvq6aa wrote

Replying to Ok_Analysis_4955 (#2,268,456)

What a depressing thing to know. I play soccer, and I love playing it, I don't practice heading, but I just play as hobby and sure in some cases I have to head the ball. It always felt nasty, but I thought surely it's safe or otherwise soccer wouldn't be as popular sport as it is.

Now I'm not sure if I should quit or simply never head the ball... I always look forward to playing and can't wait to play.

Maybe at least in training I will stop heading any faster moving balls. From now on though whenever I head the ball I'm left wondering how many IQ points did I exactly lose this time. Was it 0.01 or 0.001? 100 or 1000 headings would yield in drop of 1 IQ point.

I would like to see a study where it compares IQs (and other mental performance test results) at certain age for soccer players and IQ for same players in 10 years or different various time periods. For all pro, amateur, sunday league.

2

SnooPuppers1978 t1_jcvucab wrote

Replying to uberneoconcert (#2,271,959)

> I was a D1 scholarship athlete and there was no way I was telling anyone when I got a concussion in high school after they made it clear what the risks were, including field removal.

For clarification, I don't know anything about US and American Football, you did not tell because it would have hindered your career or you made a typo here and you meant you would definitely because of the health risks?

When did your neuro issues first appear and how?

1

sf_sf_sf t1_jcvy5xi wrote

I also wonder what the "base rate" of neurodegenerative disease would be in this population WITHOUT headers. These is a group of healthy athletic people with good cardiovascular health so you would expect they would have a better base neurodegenerative disease rate. That 1.5x rate could be even worse if this cohort would in a vacuum have better brain health.

3