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ZSpectre t1_j5mn6ln wrote

Reply to comment by XiphosAletheria in Argument for a more narrow understanding of the Paradox of Tolerance by doubtstack

While double negatives hurt my brain, I'm hoping someone can tell me if my different explanation that kind of ends up with a similar conclusion holds up in any way.

The way I've been thinking about it is that advocating for tolerance was never about advocating for tolerance in every context. To me, it's more of a shorthand to say "tolerance toward those who have immutable traits that they can't control." There would thus be no contradiction to be intolerant toward discriminatory ideologies (in this case, having a discriminatory ideology isn't an immutable trait).

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XiphosAletheria t1_j5na2a5 wrote

> in this case, having a discriminatory ideology isn't an immutable trait.

Except it sort of is. At least, you can't just change your political beliefs, or any belief really, through an act of will. Beliefs may change on their own, of course, but inasmuch as they can't be changed by your choice, they probably qualify as "immutable" in the way you seem to be trying to get at.

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Takseen t1_j5o1r21 wrote

Exactly. That's why the idea of "thoughtcrime" from 1984 was so horrific, because you can't fully control what you think even when you have a very strong incentive from a repressive state to do so.

Denying anyone their individual rights because of their political or other beliefs should be a horrifying idea too. Only actions likely to lead to harm should lead to restrictions to your rights. Like public calls to or threats of violence

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ZSpectre t1_j5ox44s wrote

Thanks for the feedback, and I definitely see your point. I was about to bring up how I meant characteristics that one isn't born with, but then that wouldn't address religious bigotry. I do remember how I originally saw the phrase as "intolerant to hateful ideologies toward traits that people don't have ANY control over," which may work better, but still may be ambiguous when we'd get to the topic of how much growing up and being nurtured in an echo chamber could impact our nature.

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