cartoptauntaun t1_j7unoq2 wrote on February 9, 2023 at 3:14 PM

Reply to comment by kryori in 3 reasons not to be a Stoic (but try Nietzsche instead) by Apotheosical

I’m an ex-Christian and I understand your criticism but I do think it rings empty for believers.

Asking “god, grant me” is a literal request, like you said, but (in my upbringing) the appeal to god is more about humility and invoking the spiritual. By selecting this prayer and holding it in their heart a person has made the decision to focus their intentions this way. It’s a different type of communication is all.

kryori t1_j7wswfl wrote on February 9, 2023 at 11:23 PM

The root of stoicism was the understanding that the only thing one can control is themselves and their own reactions to the outside world. They knew they couldn't control the gods. So, rather than pray to Zeus for bravery or Hera for wisdom, they worked to foster bravery and wisdom within themselves. You can take their ideas and express them in prayer, but if you say that prayer is equivalent to that idea you're just wrong. The prayer adds supplication and dependence upon the divine that stoics rejected.

cartoptauntaun t1_j7x59nn wrote on February 10, 2023 at 12:52 AM

I don’t think it’s fair to equate the broad spectrum of modern religious practice and beliefs about divinity with millennium old beliefs about the Roman pantheon. It’s a little ahistorical to apply the writing of Marcus Aurelius to modern belief systems.

“They knew they couldn’t control the gods” is fundamental to many modern religions, especially non-fundamentalists, which make up the bulk of religious adherents AFAIK.