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Adventurous_Key3647 t1_iyrulbo wrote

Reply to comment by bigmoneyswagger in University of Pennsylvania student attacked in Center City; female suspect sought by JBizznass

Just like Bill Burr said in his latest special back in the day you had like 10 minutes tops to act crazy in public before they’d throw you in a van. They just don’t do it anymore. I get that the practices back in the day were horrible and inhumane but a solution does need to happen. They’re a danger to others and themselves and harms the city as a whole. How does the richest country not have a way to handle this in a humane way?

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TheBSQ t1_iyry1ge wrote

Involuntary commitment to psychiatric hospitals is common throughout the world and does not need to be horrific. There are plenty of ways to do it with safeguards and oversight.

It’s very heavily used in Japan, used at fairly high rates in places like Finland, Switzerland, etc. Its part of the reason those countries don’t feel as sketchy as the US when you visit. They don’t have mentally I’ll people just wandering the streets screaming weird shit, smearing poop on stuff, and acting erratic.

But here in the US, we decided that since we sucked at psychiatric commitment the past, we should never do it again.

The left convinced themselves this was the best thing to do to keep vulnerable people from being abused, and the right loved the idea of gutting free social / medical services.

And to this day, even in a era of hyper partisanship, it’s one of the few things where, when polled, the majority of the left, right, and center all say that involuntary psychiatric commitment is bad.

And every public and quasi-public space in nearly every big city suffers as a result.

But if we were to do it, I’d bet that people’s comfort using (and their support for) public stuff, like transit, would go up tremendously.

But as long as we let nut jobs roam free, there’s always going to be people who prefer to lock themselves in their own private steel box to travel around.

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WonderfulGuide306 t1_iyugxjs wrote

I’m gonna need a source on right wingers saying involuntary commitment of the criminally insane is bad.

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gimmethatburger420 t1_iyvedi2 wrote

you disagree that the right wing doesn’t want to spend government money on social services? it was Reagan who gutted their federal funding

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bigmoneyswagger t1_iyrv0zt wrote

I wonder if we should adopt NYC’s new policy for this sort of stuff

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Adventurous_Key3647 t1_iyrxew9 wrote

I know nyc gets a bad rap but at least I feel safe in their trains/ walking around. Not that I don’t feel safe here but nyc is doing something right. It got real cleaned up. It has a way to go but we haven’t even begun here.

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bigmoneyswagger t1_iyrympv wrote

I think it starts with the police, mayor, and DA acknowledging we have a bad problem and working together to actually do something beyond pointing fingers. You’re right, we are a long way off.

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Raecino t1_iyryj18 wrote

Hahah feel safe on NYC trains? Are you joking? There’s been plenty of attacks on New York trains, far more than there have been here. The mentally ill often lurk in the subways in New York.

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bigmoneyswagger t1_iys4a10 wrote

The rates of these attacks are astronomically low. You need to consider how many people / trains are in NYC. Naturally there are more incidences, but as a % they are extremely low.

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Adventurous_Key3647 t1_iys56br wrote

This is what I think. Plus it’s just like herd mentality for me. I feel safer knowing that if I go onto a subway in nyc at any time it will be packed with people. In Philly, rush hour might even have just 1 or 2 people. And I’ve just been targeted one too many times already. I no longer take the train here.

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Do_it_with_care t1_iysccxv wrote

Your right they are low. I see thousands of people riding every day and traveling with my Nurse bag into some seedy areas I’ve not had a problem in 30 years. Keep in mind millions of folks take public transport every day. There’s over 8 million people living in such a tight area, so yeah it’s amazing the amount of freedom there is compared to other cities, considering that the danger is low. Born and raised in Philly during the 60’s & 70’s and didn’t have a problem either. Sure they’re mentally ill folks but not as wild as some of the countries I’ve stayed in abroad.

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Raecino t1_iys5489 wrote

The rates of the attacks are high, not low. I’m not sure where you got that from but I’ve seen the difference with my own eyes and from experiences of family and friends who live in NYC. Philly is more dangerous than New York there’s no question about that, but attacks from mentally ill people on the subway happen much more frequently in New York than in Philly.

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bigmoneyswagger t1_iys5qx6 wrote

They happen more frequently because there are astronomically more trains / rides. We literally have 3 light rail lines.

You need to look at rates not gross number of incidences. That’s like saying there are more murders in nyc than Philly so nyc is less safe. Makes no sense.

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Accomplished-Low-173 t1_iysa481 wrote

The funny (sad) thing is, Philly has not only a higher murder rate then NYC, but also way more murders in absolute numbers.

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Raecino t1_iys649r wrote

There’s more murders in Philly though, not just comparing rates. And going by the rate I’d still say there are more attacks on nyc trains. You wouldn’t know that if you didn’t spend considerable time in NYC taking the subway.

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bigmoneyswagger t1_iys6dwl wrote

I think it’s well known NYC trains are safer than Philly trains. So I’ll just leave it at that, not worth arguing further.

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Accomplished-Low-173 t1_iysa84s wrote

Have you actually taken the subway? It isn’t only much safer then septa, it feels like it too.

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Raecino t1_iysgn38 wrote

I lived in NYC for 12 years, and yes I was taking the subway the entire time I lived there. I witnessed violence more often on New York trains than I ever have in Philly. People get pushed in front of trains far more often in New York than happens here in Philly.

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TantricEmu t1_iysmlt5 wrote

Just because you ride the subway in NYC doesn’t mean you know the numbers of frequency and rates of violence. This info is collected and analyzed, not based on “feel” of people who live there.

I haven’t checked either numbers so I’m not making any claims here, maybe you’re right or wrong, but your experience of riding the subway isn’t exactly scientific.

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Raecino t1_iyt691j wrote

So check the numbers and come back and tell us. Because I can guarantee you the numbers back what I’m saying. You didn’t live in NYC did you, so how would you know? Since you don’t have the numbers or the “feel” to be able to argue this with me. Show me some facts if you have them.

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TantricEmu t1_iyt6nkk wrote

Well I don’t care that much, but you seem convinced. I’m also not making any claims. You are making claims though, so why don’t you show some numbers?

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Adventurous_Key3647 t1_iys3f7q wrote

Yes I do feel safer. Despite what you see on social media. I am in nyc very often and I’ve never seen anything. Often the cars are very crowded and most people look decent just trying to pass the time.

In Philly, I’ve almost been attacked. The cars are always empty except for questionable looking people. Idk if it’s my luck but every time I ride the BSL it’s empty except for a few very shady looking characters and of course they try to talk to me. I’m just over it.

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Raecino t1_iys4udv wrote

I lived in NYC for 12 years, you get a better idea of the safety when you live there compared to just visiting. There’s definitely been more consistent attacks on the subways there compared to attacks on the trains here. Of course personal experience varies but overall NYC subways are more dangerous.

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Accomplished-Low-173 t1_iysamy2 wrote

Where did you live? I lived in Bed Stuy (not the gentrified Bed Stuy, but near Broadway Junction Bed Stuy) and the trains are much safer in NYC. Even in Brownsville and in the worst areas of the Bronx

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Raecino t1_iysh96p wrote

Doubt that. I lived in Astoria Queens and East Harlem. I worked as a realtor so I took the trains to every part of the city almost every single day. Not only were fights more common on New York trains but incidents where mentally ill people randomly attacked others is more common there. I knew coworkers who were attacked (one was stabbed trying to intervene when a mentally ill man attacked a pregnant woman), my cousin was beat over the head with a pipe on a train in queens, I’ve gotten into a fight myself there as well among many other examples I could give personally and what’s been on the news. It’s just not true that the trains are more dangerous in Philly.

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Accomplished-Low-173 t1_iysjqp4 wrote

Well ok, 125th st Lexington av is probably the absolute worst station in NYC. But Queens? Even Jamaica Center (which is most likely the most “sketch” station in Queens) is MUCH nicer than City Hall. Idk bro. You might have been unlucky. I mean Astoria? Can’t get safer than that neighborhood, including the Subway

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Accomplished-Low-173 t1_iys9l2n wrote

Right, but cmon. Compare the el and BSL to any line in New York. Our trains are much more sketch, it’s not even comparable. Even if you take the train to the Bronx, it’s just feels much more civilized. The mta is huge compared to septa, you have to consider rates

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Raecino t1_iysgh3a wrote

I’m talking less of how it feels and the actual attacks that have taken place on New York trains

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lemming-leader12 t1_iyukf9g wrote

Bro I moved from Philly to NYC. In Philly I never used the trains because they hardly got you anywhere and they were sketchy as fuck.

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phoenix762 t1_iys9iad wrote

In theory, it’s an excellent idea, mental health care is just lacking terribly.

Problem is, once the person is picked up and sent to the ER….where do they go?

They already have serious overcrowding.

Health care is broken.

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isotope_322 t1_iys3m4e wrote

They shut down most of the psychiatric hospitals in the 80’s to save money lol. We don’t have enough doctors/nurses to staff our regular hospitals, let alone reopen psych hospitals

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