Comments
bukkakedebeppo t1_ixmlcva wrote
It has so much potential! It would be great for there to be fun stuff to do off of the boardwalk. I like this idea a lot.
pasnow t1_ixmiwa8 wrote
Would love to see it as Vegas East
BUrower t1_ixn0hcb wrote
Vegas is over-developed. I actually think AC has too many casinos as well. Should honestly keep Ocean Club, Harrahs, Borgata, Trop and Hard Rock. Bulldoze the rest. Build condos, mixed use development, triplexes and maybe a handful of single family houses in their place.
pasnow t1_ixq738c wrote
was a figure of speech. Yeah, not verbatim like Vegas, but a weekend getaway spot. More year round tho
napsdufroid t1_ixkcb7v wrote
May be too far gone at this point
headykruger t1_ixkdfrg wrote
Not sure why you are down voted - have people been there recently??
melikeybouncy t1_ixkz356 wrote
yeah I've been to AC recently. But I was also in Fishtown 15 years ago, Fairmount 20 years ago, and Manayunk 30 years ago.
A couple billion in investments can turn around a "too far gone" neighborhood.
headykruger t1_ixm0pmg wrote
None of those neighborhoods are as bad as ac
multile t1_ixm0xip wrote
Were you there 15, 20, and 30 years ago?
respondstostupidity t1_ixmomhz wrote
What's with the revisionist history? Fishtown wasn't bad 15, 20 or 30 years ago. Heroin was less of a thing during ANY of those times, pills didn't even become an issue until the '00s. Eddie Bisch was the first dude that made the news.
headykruger t1_ixmpt9h wrote
20 years ago the dorkiest dude i knew moved fishtown - it was already gentrifying
respondstostupidity t1_ixmqi1p wrote
These people are ridiculous man, talk out of their asses constantly
pasnow t1_ixmjpdk wrote
All 3 were already gentrified in the timelines you gave. Fishtown 2007, yeah I almost bought there. Fairmount 2002 was definitely fine, and Manayunk 1992 was yuppie-fying already. None were nearly dangerous. Is AC hopeless, no I don't think so. But it needs A LOT. Mostly, attract WFH employees, improve the schools, and create jobs for the locals. It all sorta ties together, but requires time & investment. Also a little help from mother nature by no major flooding in the next decade or two.
In fairness, as sketchy as the boardwalk can get, I don't think there's been any gunpoint robberies, which I can't say the same for Center City and Philly as a hole, so there's hope!
filladellfea t1_ixl8yw6 wrote
there was a point in philadelphia where you would be considered fucking insane to willingly spend time in kensington - and now it's arguably the hottest area for development in the city.
anything can happen with enough money.
Mcjibblies t1_ixlslcs wrote
And if that sounds too far fetched, West Philly is actually considered a really attractive housing market right now.
jbphilly t1_ixlvuew wrote
West Philly is a huge and diverse place. If you’re talking about University City, that’s nothing new or surprising in the slightest.
Cobbs Creek is certainly starting to gentrify (as people get priced out of east of 52nd) which is newer, but also was predictable enough if prices in Cedar Park continued to get unreasonable. And I don’t know if it’s really all that hot now, notwithstanding some eyebrow-raising sale prices during the height of the boom prior to interest rates going up.
Mcjibblies t1_ixmfxn5 wrote
$400K at 62nd and Walnut, that’s all I have to say.
Neighborhoods can and will change
jbphilly t1_ixn3806 wrote
This made me curious and I checked out the Sold option on Zillow. Closest thing I see is a 3 bed/3 bath house at 62nd and Walnut for $245k from earlier this year. That is a pretty bananas price for that far west and does speak to a wild market, but I'm not seeing 400k. That number just started to show up for larger houses in the 52-5300s at the height of low-interest-rate real estate boom.
There are some people with clearly no grasp on what the market will actually support, listing houses like this at 62nd and Ellsworth for laughable prices. But I don't see the real gentrification wave reaching that far any time soon.
kman1018 t1_ixt865a wrote
How much would you value the house in that listing at?
jbphilly t1_ixv2nov wrote
I have no idea honestly, but 470k is absolutely insane for that location.
Mcjibblies t1_ixq6mct wrote
So, I see about 4 or 5 houses over $300K, and one for $470K on south 62nd. I am trying to see how I can see previous home sales prices for the $400K at 62nd and Walnut.
South West for close to $400K is insane
pasnow t1_ixmjy6n wrote
There's jobs paying $100 grand within a bike ride of theses areas tho. Not the same for AC. Their best shot is making it attractive to WFH Philly & NYers, or cheaper 2nd home & AirBnB properties.
Robotchickjenn t1_ixlu715 wrote
Because if NYC can go from "Fear City" to what it is now, then we can believe that it's possible for every American city.
For those of you not around in the 70s and early 80s, NYC was like the Southside of Chicago. It was dangerous for everyone, crime didn't need a purpose it was just everywhere. It was despicable. But it's a safer city now. It's not at all like it used to be.
headykruger t1_ixm0r9h wrote
It took 20 years for nyc to turn around
YoungHeartOldSoul t1_ixmf3bq wrote
Shortsightedness is the bane of society.
headykruger t1_ixmf55u wrote
Lol
Robotchickjenn t1_ixm1hat wrote
Gotta start somewhere
[deleted] t1_ixmxzx7 wrote
[removed]
napsdufroid t1_ixkeb8h wrote
Either they haven't or don't understand how much AC has downslid in the last 20 years.
ryzen2024 t1_ixkp200 wrote
I almost downvoted this to match the vibe of the previous comment… but that’s kind of a dick move.
[deleted] t1_ixmxvdb wrote
[removed]
Little_Noodles t1_ixklzic wrote
But, and hear me out here … what if three rich assholes found a way to take what desperate people are currently doing for money in AC, and monetized it to their benefit without ever actually having to do sex work themselves?
FWIW, I’m all for legalizing and normalizing sex work. Work is work. But I don’t trust any of this crew to head up the effort.
Mcjibblies t1_ixlso1c wrote
“Capitalism”
[deleted] t1_ixkmpmm wrote
[removed]
[deleted] t1_ixlfu66 wrote
[removed]
IamSauce4 t1_ixkk0js wrote
Manayunk could look like Amsterdam with better investment in the Schuykill canal.
_jeremybearimy_ t1_ixlwzmk wrote
This gave me a chuckle cuz Amsterdam is like the flattest place on the planet
ArcticSploosh t1_ixqbfij wrote
There’s actually an ongoing project right now to redevelop/restore the Sluice House right outside of Manayunk and reconnect the canal to the Schuykill. So, they’re trying.
Fitz2001 t1_ixlr3dk wrote
The last thing Manayunk needs is more development.
0716718227 t1_ixlrun0 wrote
More housing is good tho
Fitz2001 t1_ixluvga wrote
You don’t live here. They are putting hundreds of new apartments every year, with minimal new parking, all while cutting septa bus lines.
0716718227 t1_ixly4sd wrote
Obviously there should be higher frequency for bus routes. Plus, Manayunk has excellent rail access to downtown, it makes sense that parking isn’t as much of a priority.
Nexis4Jersey t1_ixm05tp wrote
Needs more rail service , every 20mins...
EnemyOfEloquence t1_ixmg0mm wrote
>Plus, Manayunk has excellent rail access to downtown
They come like every hour (mostly 2) at best. Rail access sucks. Plus from Roxborough it's extremely difficult to get to the rail.
0716718227 t1_ixmidcz wrote
That’s an easily fixable thing though, they just need to up frequency. I agree roxborough is different
pianomanzano t1_ixk9jvb wrote
AC already has a head start on looking more like Amsterdam’s red light district
CardinalM1 t1_ixkh0ur wrote
Amsterdam's red light district is actually nice. It's basically a tourist area. Grab a bite to eat, watch tourists walking around, and cheer on the guys and girls negotiating fees for sex!
Little_Noodles t1_ixkkwx7 wrote
Oh, yeah, sounds super nice.
I’m all for legalization, and there’s certainly worse examples, but don’t romanticize Amsterdam’s handling of it.
CardinalM1 t1_ixkmneu wrote
I don't think the article makes the point you're trying to make.
For one thing, the article isn't specifically talking about sex work; it's talking about people who are exploited in "construction, agriculture, transport, sex and catering industries, as well as amongst people forced by criminals to beg".
Also, the article credits the Netherlands as handling this well:
>The Australian report ranks the Dutch government as having one of the world’s strongest responses to modern slavery
I lived in the Netherlands for 6 months and can tell you from first-hand experience that Atlantic City is in MUCH worse shape than Amsterdam.
Snertmetworst t1_ixmr149 wrote
I am from the Netherlands and i live in Philly now and have been to Atlantic City and I can vouch for this. To get AC to look like Amsterdam they'd neeeed a lot more than 3 billion.
SantorumsGayMasseuse t1_ixkm5td wrote
Oh boy wait till you see how America does in that ranking. Sounds like it would fit right in.
Little_Noodles t1_ixkmujq wrote
I mean, I’m the one that linked the report. I saw the U.S. on there.
How is the U.S. having a dodgy track record on human trafficking and slavery an argument FOR adopting a district ALSO associated with human trafficking and slavery?
Like, I’d get it if we were knocking it out of the park - yeah, it’s a problem there, but we’re really good at this. But we’re not that good at this.
PotatoPlank t1_ixkphdd wrote
>How is the U.S. having a dodgy track record on human trafficking and slavery an argument FOR adopting a district ALSO associated with human trafficking and slavery?
The point is the article you linked references a study that doesn't distinguish between types of slavery you can't reasonably use that to draw your conclusion. Especially when they rate the United States as having three times the vulnerability index to the Netherlands, and almost 14 times the number of modern slaves
SantorumsGayMasseuse t1_ixkofpp wrote
I'm really just being facetious. I'm not for or against it, I think what's being proposed is impossible. Dumping a bunch of money into Atlantic City is not going to turn it into Amsterdam. The conditions that make Amsterdam a cool city, even if it does have a seedy underbelly at its center, are simply not present in the United States. It's not just 'canals and brothels.'
That said, I think it's pretty silly to pretend that what goes on in Amsterdam is uniquely evil. The same thing is going on in every facet of American culture
[deleted] t1_ixl1ham wrote
[removed]
[deleted] t1_ixl9bse wrote
[removed]
[deleted] t1_ixlfd96 wrote
[removed]
I_Belsnickel t1_ixkg2kb wrote
Yeah, sadly even $3 billion for new homes doesn’t change the city.
IrishWave t1_ixkrwzj wrote
I don't understand who they think the target audience will be. There's not enough jobs in AC to support the local population as is, so 10,000 new homes makes no sense. Offices need to be located near workers, and it would be very difficult for a company to just up and move to a region with little to no college workers, not to mention a region where housing is either incredibly expensive or in very undesirable neighborhoods. Retail is just as baffling as there's plenty of cheap locations in the heart of Atlantic city would already be transformed for this if there was any customer interest.
Seems like this is just destined to be Revel 2.0 if it goes through.
_crapitalism t1_ixl5g8s wrote
ig they're banking on "build it and they will come," but Atlantic City is far enough away from a major metro area that I'm not sure that will hold true.
hexagonalshit t1_ixlmfzp wrote
Wouldn't they just be vacation homes and retirees?
themightychris t1_ixmd8kv wrote
it's possible there's enough remote workers now who will pick a beach city that's close enough to metros for occasional commutes to join their daily zoom calls from
pasnow t1_ixmk74d wrote
That needs to be their direction.
hexagonalshit t1_ixpxd08 wrote
Good point
Hashslingingslashar t1_ixmqzsk wrote
I could see it being popular among wealthier international immigrants.
Vigorously_Swish t1_ixmpcb7 wrote
Remote work in tech isn’t slowing down, despite what the biggest companies might have you believe. They all want their workers back in office because their campuses are mini-ecosystems that will rot away otherwise, making it a huge waste of money they won’t be able to sell easily. Most tech is still done from home these days.
BUrower t1_ixn0yl3 wrote
The prices in all the other neighboring shore towns have sky rocketed in the last 10 years. AC in many ways has a blank slate and people will start to go there if nice developments are built. It's a train ride from Philly and the casinos have year round quality restaurants that you don't necessarily get in the other shore towns.
It will take a massive amount of capital to get the ball rolling, but the potential is absolutely there.
iconfuseyou t1_ixl9t30 wrote
Our autocross club runs in that lot. It’s a lot of land, but it’s not actually near anything of note. It does have some easy access to the expressway but also not a lot of local infrastructure otherwise. AC is just too far from Philly or New York to become a large metropolitan area, and doesn’t have a sustainable industry of its own (outside the casinos which are going to hurt more now that Philly has better options). And it’s not like the Pineys actually want to go or live there either. I don’t see the opportunity in that area without some major redevelopment.
I-take-beast-shits t1_ixmacw0 wrote
Correct, Cherry Hill is the closest major “white collar” non-seasonal hub that has the industry salaries required to support and sustain this type of build. Nobody from Cherry Hill is doing this 45+ minute commute
TheBSQ t1_ixktdlo wrote
As someone that has worked in low-income communities for decades, one thing I don’t think “normies” get is that when you have multiple generations of severe poverty in a row, shit gets really fucked up in deep and profound ways that there’s no quick fix to. It takes like half a century (if not more) of sustained and committed work to create incremental progress one generation at a time so that the grandkids of today’s severely poor have a decent chance.
But if you’re thinking geography, not people, sometimes you can revive areas via gentrification and displacement.
_crapitalism t1_ixl5csx wrote
that's why I always hate when people on hear complain about krasners policies "not working." like, yeah, you're dealing with multi-generational poverty. nothing that the DA has power to do will improve the situation overnight. it'd take decades of no mass incarceration to even begin seeing the effects of such policies.
GooFoYouPal t1_ixm096s wrote
It’s not his job to fix multi-generational poverty. His job is literally to prosecute crime. He’s objectively failing to do that or prove to be even remotely competent.
doc89 t1_ixlxrx5 wrote
Just have to put up with decades of violent crime and rising murder rates, then obviously everything will get magically better for reasons, yeah makes perfect sense
_crapitalism t1_ixmeyr7 wrote
we've put up with that because of decades of tough on crime DAs who have put massive swaths of the city into deep poverty. we need to stop doing that if we ever want crime to get better long term. the US has the highest incarceration rate of any country on the planet, yet somehow, we still haven't become the safest country on the planet. we need to try something different, and allowing time for families to build wealth without being incarcerated is a good idea.
doc89 t1_ixmfsau wrote
The idea that incarcerating violent criminals is a primary cause of poverty is completely insane, imo
_crapitalism t1_ixmh9md wrote
take a look at the list for yourself and draw your own conclusions. sort by incarcerations per 100k and scroll until you find a low-poverty nation anywhere near the US. then come back here and tell me the problem is we don't arrest enough people.
doc89 t1_ixmjrsw wrote
I'm not saying "the problem is we don't arrest enough people". I'm saying "stop arresting people" is not a serious strategy to fight poverty.
Correlation does not imply causation. The US is a very different country than most of our low-crime European peers. We have orders of magnitude more guns, violence and crime. Hence it should not be a surprise that our incarceration rate is higher.
There are certainly arguments to be made that we incarcerate way too many people for, e.g., drug related offenses, but a blanket policy of "stop arresting people" seems like pure insanity to me.
_crapitalism t1_ixmlm8g wrote
I never said stop arresting people for violence, I said that arresting more people is linked to more crime, and so arresting less people for things like possession of drugs, petty theft, and other minor offenses is good, and not charging those people is good policy.
NonIdentifiableUser t1_ixlvxt4 wrote
I’ve been going to AC several times a year for a decade (some before that as well but with less regularity) and I have no idea why everyone is so damn negative on it. If anything it’s improved significantly - most of the casinos have seen non-gaming investment, there’s an indoor water park opening in/adjacent to the Showboat and they also have an indoor electric go-kart track and large arcade area, there’s (some) new construction around, Stockton has a campus there now, etc.
Sure, it’s still suffering the ill-effects of assholes like Trump trying to pilfer it without bothering to make any real investment into the city itself, but it still feels like it’s at least on an upward trajectory, even if it still has a ways to go
ecnelov t1_ixn6ox6 wrote
I hadn’t been there in close to a decade but was just there a few weeks ago for a concert and I agree with you. It looked a lot nicer than it used to.
horsebatterystaple99 t1_ixylk6u wrote
I like a day trip, and the atmosphere, not sure I would not want to live there though.
Nexis4Jersey t1_ixm037m wrote
I would rather see a development like this in Camden along the waterfront then in a high risk coastal flood area like AC...
31November t1_ixo2zkc wrote
Even just basic investment in Camden would be nice. Trees and shade on the sidewalks along the coast, a few parks, and a few more nice things to do near Rutgers. Small quality of life things to make Camden’s waterfront more pedestrian-friendly would go a long way for relatively cheap.
They make it unwalkable to keep the poor out, but they don’t realize the tourists they also keep out
jersey_girl660 t1_iy381ee wrote
Camden already has basic investment lol
Hib3rnian t1_ixmlqn6 wrote
Seriously, AC is going to be under water in 10 years.
Nexis4Jersey t1_ixmnvlo wrote
Should just demolish the entire city and rebuild it in Camden which has the space...turn AC into a nature preserve...
prlugo4162 t1_ixkw35l wrote
I would love to see Atlantic City thrive again.
fatandlean t1_ixl83rw wrote
Mmhmm. Definitely not grifters. No way there is anything shady going on in a $3B pitch about Atlantic City made by a couple of guys from Philly. The only thing that would make it more legit would be if Donald Trump were attached to the project.
gn0meCh0msky t1_ixn4no1 wrote
Well, sir, there's nothin' on Earth like a genuine bona-fide electrified six-car monorail!
NoREEEEEEtilBrooklyn t1_ixkyj8b wrote
I think there’s a better chance of eliminating all violent crime in Philadelphia than there is of this plan working.
Cobey1 t1_ixkkn8k wrote
They must’ve seen what Hilco is trying to do with that “Bellwether district” project in SW Philly and want to follow suit.
SeaPoem717 t1_ixkwjwk wrote
It’s weird hearing my parents tell stories about how AC used to be the “east coast Vegas”
carolineecouture t1_ixm3wsr wrote
It was! I saw the Supremes and Frankie Valli and the Four Seasons from my Dad's shoulders at like five years old. Bike rides on the boardwalk at sunrise. the Steel Pier and the diving horse. Hot Belgian Waffles with ice cream after a day at the beach. It was a magical place.
Now it is sad but it might be different.
skylander495 t1_ixky5r7 wrote
Of course it's Post Brothers. They tend to talk a big game
Hashslingingslashar t1_ixmr7d0 wrote
*Blastien talks a big game without getting much done, but Post Bro’s actually do get stuff done. Pretty sure they’re building the two largest multifamily projects currently under construction in Philly in NoLibs and at Broad & Washington. Blastien had to bring them in to save his ass at Broad and Washington.
[deleted] t1_ixmn5f8 wrote
[removed]
selfdstrukt t1_ixl1k2r wrote
Amsterdam or Hamsterdam?
the3trainthatcould t1_iy4oala wrote
Why not both?
djspacebunny t1_ixkxnng wrote
It seems like a bad idea to have a canal system with rising sea levels. Venice is having problems, and Amsterdam has some lead time on this proposed AC thing when it comes to keeping water at bay.
horsebatterystaple99 t1_ixlxh47 wrote
It's going to look more like Florida, not Amsterdam. It's not really not a good place to build. FEMA classifies it as a 'high risk' flood zone, I guess they may raise everything up? But good luck getting flood insurance, if you buy a place there.
pwrdup829 t1_ixlr19n wrote
Already has hookers and drugs
IKillZombies4Cash t1_ixlyijr wrote
Marty Bird involved in this project?
HoagiesDad t1_ixnftef wrote
Worst case projection puts Shows a 3’ rise in sea levels by 2100. AC is 7’ above sea level. Probably worth the risk. All of us will be dead in 2100.
Meekois t1_ixkzmau wrote
Yeah, good luck with that. Im rooting for'em but not holding my breath.
willc9393 t1_ixlwvwo wrote
Let’s add prostitution and legal heroin use. I am sure this is plan of these wealthy developers.
AC will be just as nice as Amsterdam.
ten-million t1_ixm4f5p wrote
It’ll end up being more like Venice in a few years.
shaneroneill t1_ixmjg9b wrote
They came up with this idea whilst partaking in all the Amsterdam has to offer. Red light district and all.
Dryheavemorning OP t1_ixmmjt5 wrote
New Jersey has better weed than Amsterdam now.
[deleted] t1_ixkyg7m wrote
[deleted]
Yeti_Urine t1_ixmf026 wrote
It will be more like Atlantis city in about 50 years. Totally underwater.
[deleted] t1_ixnw7ik wrote
[removed]
PatAss98 t1_ixmps41 wrote
Two Questions. How far is it from the NJTransit station since Transit Oriented Development is pretty popular right now? Two: How are they gonna prepare for more frequent hurricanes and storm surges that go this far north in the next few decades?
AssassinPanda97 t1_ixn7rzk wrote
Bader Field is about a 15-20 min bus ride from the bus terminal and train station
schoolairplane t1_ixmq1ay wrote
Can’t be a casino destination anymore, Jersey needs this
YourMooseKing t1_ixnrb5m wrote
I don’t see Atlantic City being revived if they keep charging Vegas prices. It’s not an upscale place so stop pricing it that way.
MainLineJDM t1_ixlt8dl wrote
This kind of investment will pay off if the northeast USA looks more like Megacity 1 from Dredd in a few hundred years. Other than that dystopian nightmare scenario AC has no redeeming qualities after you realize Monopoly has its streets based on AC.
heathers1 t1_ixnnf92 wrote
anything would be an improvement over the disgusting mess trump started
AbaloneDifferent4168 t1_ixnoguj wrote
Hurricanes will creep up in power and in northern latitudes and ferocity as climate change accelerates. Wouldn't get too excited about this idea.
stug41 t1_ixqf6ga wrote
Just give it 50 more years and AC will be below water level, just like amsterdam, no investment needed
p_britt35 t1_ixkkq22 wrote
Has anyone involved in the project been to AMS or understand the 1000+ year old history of the city? AC should be burned to the ground if they're serious.......just start over.
crispin2015 t1_ixnch6c wrote
It would need to remove the boardwalk and gentrify a lot of the area first.
Little_Noodles t1_ixkbxzw wrote
I mean this both sarcastically and sincerely.
Good fucking luck, ya trash-ass capitalist dipshits.
May the dumpster fire you light warm somebody’s paws even as it burns you to the ground.
tastycakebiker t1_ixke7bn wrote
Brutal take
kanye_come_back t1_ixki9fx wrote
The Netherlands, a famously communist nation lmao.
Little_Noodles t1_ixkl6g8 wrote
Please point to the Dutch social democrat in the photograph. Do you actually know who any of these guys are? r/Netherlands, y’all laying claim to this trio?
[deleted] t1_ixki4v7 wrote
[removed]
Little_Noodles t1_ixkihn0 wrote
Hey, Mods? I just tried to make this my user flair for the sub and it doesn’t seem to be an option. Please help.
tastycakebiker t1_ixkc74g wrote
AC being great again would be awesome. I think we can all get behind that