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SimmerDownRizzo t1_iwct5n2 wrote

When you're feeling these episodes, try to slow your breathing. Look around the room, and start naming what you see and say it out loud. Say what you see in detail like color, like "yellow banana on the kitchen table"

This helps with anxiety attacks that borderline dissociation, it may help you while you're waiting to hear back from the resources you've reached out to.

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seejordan3 t1_iwcxi1n wrote

This is so helpful. There's also a great article about panic attacks in the NYT last week.

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SimmerDownRizzo t1_iwcyn9k wrote

It has been a lifesaver, I hope OP finds a way to address the underlying issue via talk therapy and find some peace.

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seejordan3 t1_iwczacn wrote

.. and not reach for the drugs! The drugs should be the last thing people reach for, but it's more often the first. One in four doctor visits results in a prescription for a benzo. Lemmie know if you want sauce w that.

To be clear, no one should take a benzo more than a couple weeks, couple months TOPS, unless you're terminally ill. They are over prescribed. Our medical industry throws psych drugs at anyone anytime, it's disgusting and will be the next drug crises we deal with (let me know if you want sources, the NYT calls this the next opioid epidemic...)

EDIT: the fact that I'm so downvoted to me equates with people loving their benzos. That's VERY dangerous, you're playing with fire. Read below.

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PorchHonky t1_iwdzq6l wrote

Benzos would be a huge help for you while you try and figure out what is causing your panic attacks. At least you would be able to function while you try and find help.

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seejordan3 t1_iwecvqz wrote

There's newer better less addictive drugs. over 20% of people on a benzo more than 3 months will go through a prolonged withdraw process that typically is all the symptoms coming back you took it for, multiplied. This can last years. Look up Ashton and BenzoBuddies.org Benzos are very very rarely the answer. Great tool for all kinds of things, but we over prescribed it.

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robul0n t1_iwhxy18 wrote

But usually with benzos for panic attacks should only be used during the actual panic attack correct? I've got a small prescription for emergencies and just knowing I have them short-circuits most panic attacks before my adrenaline dumps. I take maybe one or two pills a year now.

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seejordan3 t1_iwhysd4 wrote

That's great, be careful as you are. And keep an eye on them, they have a street value and are regularly abused and sold, esp. by kids.

I keep opiods around for the very rare kidney stone because that's the worst pain ever.

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robul0n t1_iwhzwbv wrote

Agreed. Aware of the abuse, don't have kids, and have chilled out on the recreational drugs myself as I get older.

Most of the people I know who had long term problems with benzos were prescribed them daily with doctors happily signing off on refills.

After reading a bit I can't help but think doctors doing the prescribing are a bit out of touch with the current state of medicine.

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seejordan3 t1_iwi0zw4 wrote

Its called informed consent, and most doctors fail to give it before you take a drug. I can't tell you how many people we know that were given a 'scrip for it and not told the risks, only to find it works so great for anxiety, and now TA-DA, they're hooked and its the worst addiction ever. Like, 1000x worse than heroin withdraw. We've been in the ER for seizures too many times. Watching your partner turn blue during a seizure and being able to do nothing is one of the worst things I'll ever experience. Here's some reading on informed consent from the Mayo Clinic..
https://www.mayoclinicproceedings.org/article/S0025-6196(1160864-1/fulltext

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pandorasfishtank t1_iwf4qzm wrote

Benzos can turn down the heat to the level that people can actually think. You can't use coping skills if your brain isn't working. It sucks when the meds you need to function become trendy for people fuck around with.

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seejordan3 t1_iwfhnzk wrote

Your increased chance of dementia/alzheimers (I can't spell) goes up 50% for long term users. Really, you may not want to hear this, but they are not a good long term drug. I'm sorry. These numbers should give anyone pause.

My biggest issue with ALL psych drugs, is dr.'s fail to get informed consent from patients. They don't tell them 1:5 over 2 months get prolonged withdraw. That this drug could lead to death, and commonly does. We lost Robin Williams, Prince, Philip Seymore Hoffman, Kate Spade, and untold others who were dealing with prolonged withdrawl from benzos (yes, and other things, but ask anyone who's done a number of diff. withdraws, and benzos are without a question the worst). They're 'involved' in 30% of deaths from overdose. They really are the next epidemic. You'll understand one day.

And PandorasFishtank, honestly, I hope you find something other than benzos, and do your research. They've cost me many years of my life, and many hundreds of thousands of dollars. I would wish benzos on no one. The "relief" is a prolonging, that is all.

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acoustic11 t1_iwe0cuz wrote

Do you think that cancer patients shouldn’t be prescribed drugs? Should asthma patients not reach for the inhaler? Or do you just hold these beliefs about mental health?

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seejordan3 t1_iwebxqi wrote

Do you think one in four people that go to the doctor should be prescribed Xanax?

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acoustic11 t1_iwel8gu wrote

If they are going to get treatment for a medical condition like anxiety or panic disorder then yes they should not face barriers to medication.

You didn’t answer my question. Do you think fewer cancer patients, asthma patients, HIV patients, kidney disease patients, etc should not be prescribed medication? Or do you think that your ideals of medication restriction should only apply to mental health disorders? Genuinely curious, please do answer in good faith.

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Markellany t1_iwgnduy wrote

I find your points interesting. Would you mind sharing what your experience was like with benzos? What dosage were you on and for how long? Were you using any other treatment modalities like journaling, some form of therapy, exercise, meditation, support groups? What were some of the withdrawal symptoms you experienced?

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seejordan3 t1_iwgrpe9 wrote

I'm a caretaker, for many years, of my partner, who was on them for 15 years. Too long, right? Correct. She was incorrectly prescribed them for way too long, as many people are. A very high dose (8mg+).

Being her caretaker means I get a lot of other people needing support and advice with benzos. I can tell you, they are slowly killing us. I understand some people need them or they'll not slowly-die. It'll be fast. I get that, and I'm not saying they don't have a place. OMG, so many times we're in the ER with seizures and of COURSE the EMT's reach for benzos first, because they work. I'm no science denier. But if one in four doctor visits results in a perscription for them, there's zero chance people are being told the risks.

To answer your question about treatment routes: yes, everything you can think of and 1000 things you never thought of. Journaling, therapy, support groups (BenzoBuddies.org is incredible; and she's called SAINT Ashton in our house), daily yoga, eating REALLY healthy, Kito diet (to help with the seizures). The symptoms... there's over 100 of them. My partner could at any time list 30-80 of them. It'd be easier to write the symptoms my partner didn't experience.

We all (esp. doctors) are optimists. We say, "that won't happen to me (PAWS)". And the scrips fly. Benzos REALLY work great in the short term.. so people get hooked REALLY quick, and those "possible side effects" are forgotten about. Then the up-dosing begins for efficacy after tolerance withdraw after a couple weeks/months... and that hell I would save people from.

Benzos. They delay suffering. Prove me wrong. I am now pretty good at reading medical studies, so sources! Here's some..
https://www.cnn.com/2020/01/20/health/benzodiazepines-prescriptions-study/index.html

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8294026/

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/03/16/health/elderly-drugs-addiction.html

(let me know anyone wants more). Have a wonderful day, and thank you for coming to my Ted Talk!

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Markellany t1_iwu7xki wrote

Thank you for this information. I agree 8mg for 15 years is not appropriate. I do think they are helpful for people dealing with acute trauma, ptsd and temporary things like fear of flying etc. I have noticed that many people I know who have died prematurely were on a benzo. Clear and correct information needs to be provided to people considering any medical intervention so they can make informed decisions.

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seejordan3 t1_iwuwvb0 wrote

Oh, Benzos work, really really well. What they do, and I'm no neurologist.. is they are a crutch for your gabba factories in your brain. They flood your brain with gabba, artificially. That causes your brain to say, ".. we are good on gabba, don't need more, shut down those gabba factories". And those factories then stop working. But, you taper out pretty quickly, and need more to have the same baseline effect. So yea, they work! But only for awhile. Then you realize shit, I can't go off this or I'll die (literally, you can't just stop this drug, you have to do a many months' taper, and cross your fingers). So what's the appropriate length of time to be on them, what's the risk. Considering 20% after 2 months go into long term, I would argue its VERY VERY rarely useful. Our minds generate anxiety for a reason, to tell us to change what we're doing. Yes, it can produce so much, or so little gabba, that a person can be stuck in a hole. But, that's not time for a drug, but time to make changes in your life FIRST. Benzos will simly delay your suffering to a time when you are hopefully more capable of dealing with life stuff.

Ok now to the other end of the spectrum. Benzo deaths. About once a year we hear of someone we know dealing with depression and anxiety who was on benzos as well as SSRI's and other drugs. I realize SSRI's also have about 20% prolonged withdraw.. But its never as bad a withdraw as benzos are. So when people have a cocktail, we so often the chalk it up to "drugs", and often opiods.. but rarely do we look at the worst culprit in that cocktail: benzos.

Thanks for listening. A friend lost his brother a few months ago to suicide after being tapered out for years on benzos. People need to wake up to the danger of this drug. We simply don't understand if something works for a few months (REALLY well) that it will be very tough for people to stop taking it.

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SwimsWithSharks1 t1_iwez93s wrote

Non-paywall NYT article (via Give This Article) https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2022/11/10/well/mind/panic-attack-symptoms-causes.html?unlocked_article_code=yqSPcsZwNix2x_LTJJfQJ3PnD7dywZuBkpgK1SMB5lEpuXLJEDJ2CP2TNR_6thOSLO-RH7udN89GjB_THgpjiHzoiGrcTj3eD1DcOdY4-x2xXxmmZHtWxiZt7XnKFl73tbRUlJnTCk734CokTgAhUJK2aMDVpF0Vm10gtG_2gNf662DcZPi0F0b3wfVmAaZ-Y1ktPTqrXhFS-rq3WoHyFLBRz8ahgBr79XZq5uG6gXeP9KSN2QsvPn3YQ1mHU7lYN5PEfPFRYJllBNDbSkT4mrOBsUe_KfD8dGM9b1Q-jgmqQJkwos17LJ-IL4xyG-ZtfMuSP0wVe52auj32PelORefDrAUnPfbeAxY79D_yYAuTCPo96EZo4Q&smid=share-url

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hooplah t1_iwde482 wrote

my therapist has told me to slowly and thoughtfully list out 5 things for each sense (5 things i can see, 5 things i can hear, 5 things i can feel, 5 things i can smell, 5 things i can taste), in detail like you suggested

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kek99999 t1_iwdo5kj wrote

I do similar, but in decreasing counts (5,4,3,2,1). It’s my go to exercise to this day ANY time I feel my anxiety getting out of control. My favorite thing for sure.

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Italiana47 t1_iwd9u77 wrote

Also putting your bare feet in the grass or holding an ice cube in your hand can help ground you.

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pixel_of_moral_decay t1_iwdhbdz wrote

There’s a lot of science behind this.

You’re basically taking your brain under manual control and forcing it to focus on specific things vs you’re defective automatic behavior where certain things get excessive focus.

It also can calm down kids when they hyper focus in a tantrum or even when hurt. Asking them to “help” you by identifying 5 things they can see, smell, etc will surprisingly work.

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displacedfantasy t1_iwe88zb wrote

Great advice. If I can add a technique my therapist wife recommends: rub an ice cube or ice pack on your face, it can jolt your system out of the fight or flight response.
Splashing your face with cold water can also work and might be easier to do sometimes

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ForksandSpoonsinNY t1_iwe8icb wrote

I began having panic attacks in 2020 and putting on a meditation YouTube video to focus your breathing and help with mindfulness helped for a time push the firehose of thoughts away for a bit.

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