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AudibleNod OP t1_irfmsbz wrote

There's no single answer to reduce/prevent suicides. And this is just one thing the military is doing to tackle this worrying trend. It's a good step.

Please lock up your firearms. Not just for suicides. But for all the reasons why you should lock them up. For your kids/family. For general security. For inventory control.

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x_xStay_Uglyx_x t1_irfnrs9 wrote

My fiancee has had 5 different mental health providers this year through the VA. He waited months for his most recent telehealth appointment only to find out it was with a nurse practioner. No hate to NPs, but they're not the kind of authority a person with PTSD and multiple TBIs need. There is no actual care coming from the VA and getting community care is impossible for us. They do this on purpose to cut the amount of veterans they have to pay for and no one will ever convince me otherwise.

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KerPop42 t1_irfns6z wrote

Hm. I think this could make a good general program

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Sullyville t1_irfp6vt wrote

Replying to AudibleNod (#53,299)

Yes. A lot of times even tho the depression has been building up, the decision itself is quite impulsive, based on some bad incident or day, and the slightest inconvenience could delay the act for a little while, enough time to eat a meal or to hang out with a friend, and then the desperate moment will have passed.

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Lootcifer- t1_irfpm0u wrote

The armed forces leadership are the smartest people on the planet. I am humbled every single day by their decision making and their effectiveness. I wanna be just like them when I grow up.

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Gandydancer t1_irfpr0j wrote

From the article,

> The thought behind the program is to put up a barrier between a person’s suicidal impulse and taking action on that impulse, according to a Navy release

If the program is able to delay the completion of even a few, just long enough for them to receive effective help, as a vet myself, I'm all for it.

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KerPop42 t1_irfqfdv wrote

Replying to x_xStay_Uglyx_x (#53,348)

If they actually consider serving an honor, they should actually follow through and take care of our vets. It's disgusting, though I think it would be better if we were all just in the same network and veterans got their fees waived

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PlayfulParamedic2626 t1_irfsd0f wrote

Maybe we could fund mental health care for veterans?

No ?

Edit: I wonder why recruitment is down?

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Mick0331 t1_irft02q wrote

Anything but better conditions and healthcare. Classic Marine Corps.

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westplains1865 t1_irfubwp wrote

Replying to x_xStay_Uglyx_x (#53,348)

I'm discouraged so little has changed since I retired from the military 8 years ago. VA care was terrible then but I had heard anecdotally that things were supposedly getting better. I should have figured it's the same story of recruit people, break their bodies with hard service, then discard them when their usefulness to the big green machine is over.

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ScottColvin t1_irfuicb wrote

Replying to Gandydancer (#53,442)

Always reminds me of the massive suicide drop, when people stopped having gas ovens.

People get drunk and sad and impulsive.

A gun is just a faster, messier version of a gas oven.

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CritaCorn t1_irfziwb wrote

I have to ask

Has anyone wanted to end it but stopped b/c “oh look it’s locked, guess I’ll put it on hold?”

I get the other reasons, kids etc this is a real question. Honestly it works?

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beautyofdisorder t1_irg1mru wrote

Replying to Sullyville (#53,414)

Speaking from experience this is true. I had an amazing day. But that night I drank too much, argued too much and impulsively tried to take myself out. It was building up over time and all I needed was my threshold to be lowered and boom. Regretted it immediately.

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fbtcu1998 t1_irg2yz4 wrote

Replying to CritaCorn (#53,883)

I couldn't say if it works or not, but in theory any delay is better than nothing. I doubt it would stop anyone who's determined, but it might help with some. The farther they have to go, if they need an extra step to get a key to unlock the gun, get the ammo, etc. they all add time for someone to change their mind. While the delay is slight, it might make a lazy person just say nah. And locks are cheap, so even if it only stops the laziest of the lazy, seems worth it.

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neilmoore t1_irg6wkz wrote

Not a veteran by any means, but my wife hid her (hunting) shotgun from me just about a decade ago. I still know it's in the house somewhere, but not exactly where (edit: and I don't care to know): That simple action has saved my life multiple times by this point.

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The_Yarichin_Bitch t1_irgbgis wrote

Thank you at the fucking least for this. This is shit we want done, was that so fucking hard??

Hope this points to more safety measures for people to put in their own homes. And more vet mental care.

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DoodMonkey t1_irgeeon wrote

So the Army is can't get enough saps to serve and now this is the response? "The Army bought in 45,000 new soldiers during the 2022 fiscal year, coming up 25% short of the 60,000 goal" - offer Marines a way out? wtf

0

jw_esq t1_irgez67 wrote

Replying to CritaCorn (#53,883)

Even small barriers work. Putting Tylenol in blister-packs and limiting number of pills per box had a huge effect in the UK, as another example.

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ligmuhtaint t1_irgi0xi wrote

What a fucking slap in the face, again.

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Kim_Thomas t1_irgow6d wrote

No funding for suicide prevention, just some sad plastic. It saves the government machine money when Veterans die, so they don’t want to fix the problem. It’s obvious. Just don’t expect to ever make recruiting quotas/goals ever again. And they wonder why they’ve got a problem⁉️

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Fochinell t1_irgqck8 wrote

If the USMC version has “Death Before Dishonor” engraved into it, I’ll take seven of them.

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zaZZeni t1_irgqxak wrote

Replying to PlayfulParamedic2626 (#53,545)

Some counties in NY automatically take your firearms if you seek mental help. Nassau county is one of them.

Agree or disagree, this will keep x military or anyone with a firearm from seeking mental help.

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17times2 t1_irgrobw wrote

Replying to Happyjarboy (#54,876)

Well, it better be. We have the largest military in the world, even if you combined #2-#11, we'd still beat them. And ask nearly any veteran, they will tell you the shit care of the VA. Whether it's forcing you to use their specific facility even if you have to fly there (all costs on you), or using rejects from the local medical school for surgeries, their level of care is abysmal. I know 3 people that went in for surgeries, on the knees or back, and all of them came out worse than they did before.

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reddditttt12345678 t1_irgsmvy wrote

Replying to 17times2 (#55,138)

>We have the largest military in the world, even if you combined #2-#11, we'd still beat them

Only in terms of money and equipment.

Yes, that's what wins wars these days, but the metric that matters here is head count.

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x_xStay_Uglyx_x t1_irgxvb0 wrote

Replying to DocHolidayiN (#53,764)

We have. Twice. Called the white house complaint line. Got a lawyer. Went to an entirely different region for care. The system is fundamentally broken because it's designed that way. They want dead vets because they don't want to pay for the damage they caused. A successful VA healthcare system, much like a successful medicare system, is an advertisement for socialism and we can't have that.

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x_xStay_Uglyx_x t1_irgyb51 wrote

Replying to KerPop42 (#53,467)

Medicare for all would go a long way to fix it. I know alot of vets who prefer the idea of being able to go to a place that has veteran-centric care but it's just not working.

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knightB4 t1_irgyvvf wrote

I can't wait to hear the excuses for objecting to this!

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Mr_Metrazol t1_irh13e5 wrote

Replying to The_Yarichin_Bitch (#54,392)

Any responsible gun owner should store their firearms unloaded and in a safe.

I've long thought that eliminating sales tax on gun safes, or offering rebates or tax deductions on safes, would save a few lives. Anything and everything to encourage people to lock their guns up. It's just that goddamn simple.

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fluffyfurnado1 t1_irh6q07 wrote

Replying to AudibleNod (#53,299)

Excuse me for my ignorance, but how does this prevent suicide? Is the person locking the gun supposed to give the key to a friend? If not, wouldn’t the person just have they key and unlock it in 20 seconds?

I am definitely for suicide prevention. I’m just unaware of how this works.

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NotRoryWilliams t1_irh74oa wrote

Replying to 17times2 (#55,138)

And yet, despite all of these issues, it’s still an order of magnitude better than the health care that is provided to many working Americans, which is: you don’t get to see doctors at all, and if you call in sick you’re fired and homeless.

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NotRoryWilliams t1_irh79rr wrote

Replying to AudibleNod (#53,475)

I’m curious as to exactly how this works since the locks come with keys.

I lost my key, but still had to ask a friend to come take my shotgun because I knew where the bolt cutter was. I don’t suddenly become stupid when I’m feeling depressed.

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xSciFix t1_irhh7tl wrote

Replying to fluffyfurnado1 (#55,767)

Yeah honestly just even putting one extra step before the final impulsive action helps people stop to think about what they're about to do.

Otherwise yeah; giving the key (or the firing pin if you don't have a lock) to a friend or roommate is a good thing to do.

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xSciFix t1_irhhkz5 wrote

Replying to CritaCorn (#53,883)

I've known people who could have the self-knowledge to tell when a bad mental spell is coming on, lock up their guns, and let their SO control the key for a while. Can also take the firing pin out in a pinch. So it works in that sense at least.

I think it might help with lengthening the time someone has to think about what they're doing before the final impulsive decision but I'm not a doctor or anything.

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openmindedskeptic t1_irhigcg wrote

Replying to NotRoryWilliams (#55,802)

I know from a family member that having something locked away or out of sight can be just enough to get them from impulsively commuting suicide. A lot of the time it’s just someone saying fuck it and not thinking. The action of someone finding the key and unlocking it gives that person an extra 30 seconds to think about their decision.

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No_Biscotti_7110 t1_irhivpp wrote

It’s sometimes morbidly funny how much this country wants to avoid addressing mental health issues

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PeregrinePacifica t1_irhj5ck wrote

slaps bandaid on mortal wound

"There's, that autta do it!"

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speckyradge t1_irhl52h wrote

Replying to CritaCorn (#53,883)

I need to find the article again but yes. The UK did a lot of research in to preventing suicide and did a couple of simple things. The most common method of suicide was OTC painkiller overdose. They stopped you being able to buy more than 16 paracetamol (acetaminophen) at a time and they had to packaged in individual blister packs and not bottles.

They reckoned if you could delay someone's ability to take act on taking their own life by about 10 minutes, the probability of them following through goes down drastically. Buying multiple packs from different shops and then individually popping out a load of pills created that delay.

90% of people who attempt suicide and fail, do not reattempt. Americans don't attempt suicide much more frequently than other nations, but the success rate of firearms suicides (which are disproportionately represented in America) is far higher than any other method.

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speckyradge t1_irhlcnp wrote

Replying to zaZZeni (#55,113)

Any kind of help? California is pretty heavy on this sort of thing and you have to be 5150'd - that's an involuntary mental health hold. You are judged to be a threat to yourself or others and are held in an institution for a brief period.

If you go see a therapist or start taking anti-depressants, they don't care, keep your guns.

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Punkdandp t1_irhpva4 wrote

Replying to [deleted] (#55,706)

www.holdmyguns.org

From their site:

"Hold My Guns’ mission is to connect responsible firearm owners with voluntary, private off-site storage options, through our national network of partnering gun shops and FFLs, during times of mental health crisis or personal need."

They require background check to dropoff as well as pick up items.

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Bubba_sadie- t1_irhr6ml wrote

Ummmm that won’t stop it. Let sailors and marines access mental health without destroying their careers and maybe the three sailors I knew who killed themselves would be alive. But nope sorry I forgot we need to keep changing uniforms and here’s a free gun lock gtfo.

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lilbean_arino t1_iri3jrn wrote

Or the military could STOP TREATING ITS PEOPLE LIKE GARBAGE SO THEY DONT COMMIT SUICIDE

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PlayfulParamedic2626 t1_iri9ucn wrote

Replying to Rain_on_the_101 (#57,016)

All of the armed services encountered recruitment challenges this year, which service leaders attributed to factors including more thorough medical screenings, fewer Americans eligible to serve, and low civilian unemployment. Meanwhile, the Navy is bracing for even more significant recruitment difficulties in the coming year.

https://www.marinecorpstimes.com/news/your-marine-corps/2022/09/28/will-the-marines-be-the-only-branch-to-reach-2022-recruitment-numbers/

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456afisher t1_irid2h2 wrote

Perhaps they should send of some of those devices to TX, where National Guard members who have been deployed to the border by Gov. Abbott ...cuz (he blames Biden and ignores that DEMS / GOP used to want to update Immigration legislation (John McCain era) - but then Team Red decided to use HATE for pure political ploy.

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HardlyDecent t1_irih2ja wrote

Replying to kavihasya (#56,379)

Similar effect occurs with suicide barriers on high bridges. Just having to purposely climb over a short wall/fence is often enough to give people that second chance to think things over.

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ScheisskopfFTW t1_irijmiq wrote

Maybe next time an officer grabs my dick you could do something about it. Or we could waste money on this dumb shit.

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Eli_Yitzrak t1_irk9fis wrote

This is an amazing idea! Just like how door locks on cars stop drunk driving!

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RidingNaked101 t1_irnfdlx wrote

Thought I was browsing r/nottheonion for a sec.

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hitlerosexual t1_iro05bw wrote

This is outright insulting to vets. How about take the money spent on wasted excess in the combat end of things and put it towards adequate healthcare for vets (and for all Americans).

0

Fire2box t1_itw1bxe wrote

Replying to Brix106 (#66,839)

So it's about federal law not something about Florida itself. Apart from it being illegal on a state level I assume and thus the federal conviction applies and thus felon = no gun rights anymore.

AFAIK this doesn't happen in California. But with it being a federal crime it's always possible.

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