Submitted by WhoIsJolyonWest t3_11cysps in news
TJR843 t1_ja70pav wrote
Capitalism dictates this must continue. If two more trains full of toxic materials derail in East Palestine within the next year, and it's just as bad, guess what happens? More trains carrying toxic materials will ride the same line within a few weeks after those. The profits must continue, people be damned.
They will put out minimal aid with the only goal of that aid being staving off an increase in collective class consciousness. The population of East Palestine is small, but there are more than enough to stop any trains moving through the town if they wanted. That is what they don't want them or us to realize.
[deleted] t1_ja77vr4 wrote
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nitro316 t1_ja79lxg wrote
Blame all not just Congress.
[deleted] t1_ja7afn7 wrote
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TJR843 t1_ja8ko81 wrote
Blaming a result of the root problem and not the root problem itself is what keeps us in an infinite loop where this continues to happen and nothing changes. Congress is corrupt why? Congress backed the rail corpos why? Congress engaged in strike breaking (again) why?
[deleted] t1_ja8w8ie wrote
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TJR843 t1_ja93ze0 wrote
>But the "why" is acting legally. How do we stop it? Step 1 is making it illegal to do so and put in preventive measures that allow enforcement.
You're asking to make something illegal that is inherent to the system of profit itself. We have plenty of antitrust and labor laws that are openly unenforced if not ignored, among plenty of other laws that are ignored if they don't favor capital. What you want is simply not possible. The game is over, we lost. You will not get electoral democracy under a capitalist system to uncorrupt itself. Your leaders are defacto heads of corporations. That is the reality that needs to be understood by the working class of this country if we want anything to change. Liberal and Conservative politicians are both capitalists first and foremost, they will not side with you over who perpetuates their wealth status.
[deleted] t1_ja94m1q wrote
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TJR843 t1_ja971qe wrote
And how often do the French do what they do? Quite often. It is a constant battle under this system to collectively fight a system that by nature has an easier time fighting us. It was setup to that way for a reason. While we try to get out fellow working class people on our side and in the streets, they only need to rally a few elites to their cause, call in favors, bribe politicians and cops, pay some mercs and run constant propaganda on everyone's TV. You're on the right track though.
[deleted] t1_ja9e4st wrote
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TJR843 t1_ja9sjke wrote
I admire your optimism but if climate change doesn't take us or this country even makes it past the next election cycle the current system 50 years from now will be the same. I suggest reading some theory and books that haven't been tainted by capitalist and imperialist propaganda. My money is this country doesn't make it another 10. It can't at this rate without an outright turn towards fascism, which just like in the past the right is pushing us towards.
[deleted] t1_ja9t78w wrote
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TJR843 t1_ja9vydx wrote
Climate change will make the west and parts of the global south unlivable sooner than you think. The alternative is scrapping capitalism entirely and working towards a sustainable future that serves the needs of the many over the wants of the few. We are kneecapped by capitalism, big business and the rich from ever making any significant progress towards fixing it. That isn't even in question anymore. An economic system that demands constant and ever increasing profits, exploitation and resource extraction is incompatible with a planet that has finite resources. That's is essentially why you will see "Capitalism is a death cult" thrown around all the time. Humanity has risen to huge challenges before, we can do it, but we need to throw Capitalism in the dustbin of history.
[deleted] t1_ja9xfmp wrote
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TJR843 t1_jaa2hsw wrote
I disagree on some points above, primarily capitalism in any form continuing and a bit below but I wish you the best. Cheers.
[deleted] t1_jabj5rc wrote
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TJR843 t1_jaby4mc wrote
Sure humans need an incentive to work, but that doesn't need to be profit. Looking at plenty of civilizations outside a western lense will show you that. Working for the betterment of your fellow man and the advancement of humanity itself should be paramount. First we work to fix the environment, then we lift people across the world, then we look to the stars again. Automation and UBI benefiting the majority is great, but the way we are heading that will not be the case. You would be silly to think the owner class will give up the profits automation provides to the working class. No one should be seriously concerned about incentives to work or getting things done, that is capitalist propaganda. We're fine and rise to challenges, the owner class isn't, doesn't and never have. We have hundreds of years of history to back that up too.
[deleted] t1_jabylfu wrote
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TJR843 t1_jadla8j wrote
Define what you mean by policing. You seem to think people would be chomping at the bit to screw the system and their fellow members of the community. That doesn't happen as often as you think it does. For years now the total monetary amount stolen through wage theft by employers has been higher than the total monetary amount stolen by normal everyday criminals.
You're getting into sociology here, but "doing more for others" and "working until they're content and stopping" isn't the same under capitalism as it would be without it. You seem to be attributing capitalist thought and experience to a system that wouldn't have capitalist structures. I can assure you, the line "humans aren't built to live in communities like this" or "innovation doesn't happen under socialism/communism" or "humans are meant to be competitive with each other" are outright lies that aren't supported by any data or sociologists worth their salt.
Have you ever heard "there is no such thing as ethical consumption or living under capitalism"? Well, it's the truth. Even though I live under this system, I do my best through mutual aid efforts, volunteering my time and knowledge to help those that need it more than I do. I am involved in groups that work within my community. Under this system that is the best I can do. I don't go to Turkey for the same reasons you likely can't. You could buy me a ticket, but what are you going to do about mine and my wife's financial and familial obligations back home? Will you buy my hotel? Will you help ease the burden of me losing my job? Will you pay my rent? Groceries? Take care of my cats? The question of why don't I go to Turkey to help is honestly absurd.
Be an owner you say? I'm sorry but I was not born into a privileged class where any bank would give me a loan to start one. To get out of what I was born into I needed to take on financial burdens. People don't start at the same spot in life, nor do bankers provide the same level of assistance to the working class as they do the owner class and wealthy.
If you have the ability to start hundreds of businesses so easily, I question what your upbringing was. Are you someone born into wealth? You could start worker owned co-ops which while not perfect, would be significantly more ethical than starting a corporation or LLC. What happens after you leave? The board continues and prioritizes profit over the workers at the business you started and the cycle continues. Who's to say the person that takes your spot isn't worse?
I think you could do with reading some theory and history books if you're asking me how my ideas would work or be implemented. There are certainly people smarter than I that have studied the topics in greater length and written on the topics.
[deleted] t1_jadtamq wrote
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TJR843 t1_jae1uqn wrote
>but how you think people are, just isnt how it plays irl. Youre looking at the world how you think it should be and I think you would benefit greatly looking at it for what it is.
... sociologists don't back that claim up, so where the hell are you getting that idea from? I said read some theory and history books because it's plainly clear based on what you have been saying is that you have fallen victim (not your fault) to the endless capitalist propaganda and hustle culture bullshit that has been funneled down your throat since you got to first grade.
>Theres ways you can start a business with 0 money. Tons of work. I mean you dont get a life for 5 or so years. You got to throw everything else away and put your head down and bust ass.
Why? Not everyone wants to start a business. I don't want to be rich. I don't need monetary value to feel self worth. No one should struggle mentally and gamble their futures for a chance to start a business that has a significantly higher chance of failure and financial ruin than it does success. I could start a business doing something I like, and be good at it, but that doesn't mean it will be successful.
>When I say policing I mean say you have 5 builders. Theyre building a house. 1 of those guys doesnt work as hard or as much as the other 4. Hes lazy slow or whatever.
>That brings the morale of the 4 down. They get mad at the other guy.
This is not the rule, it is the exception. Maybe it may be worth looking into why the one guy is acting like that? It's so simple minded and an indicator you have a warped view of things to just write the "lazy guy" off as nothing but a burden without wanting to look into why that may be. You would be silly to correlate the one guy that is like this in a capitalist business to the one guy in a socialist or communist state run business.
>There are always people who look to beat the system. If theres a system in place yes people are out there learning how to beat it and manipulate it.
Again, this is the exception, not the rule. I don't know what else to say other than you have a very sad and warped view of your fellow working class people. I'm not attacking you, I just find it extremely sad to see working class people, like yourself, say something that is a myth created by the rich and capitalists to divide the working class against itself. You should read the book Blackshirts and Reds by Michael Parenti.
>In theory if i pay more then everyone else, where will the talent want to work ?
Work is more than pay, at least in capitalist structures. It's about what you offer benefits wise. The data shows people take less pay when there is more PTO and better benefits. Unfortunately though it is already from the moment of employment an unbalanced relationship. Your employees are afraid of losing their jobs mainly because there are no robust worker protections and in the US the moment you lose your job is the moment you lose your insurance. This is financial ruin for most, with 64% of yearly bankruptcies being tied to outstanding medical debt. The relationship between worker and owner on the US and capitalist structures is inherently unbalanced in favor of the owner. That isn't in question, workers are just forced to accept that.
>Im guessing youre young ?
I am in my 30s, have a degree and currently work with some of the largest corporations in the world as my clients (not by choice). I have plenty of experience and see all the evil shit I speak about first hand, which has helped to shape my views. I don't know about you, but if all you have is a business degree to go off of and not experience in that world, you don't know shit about the realities of what it's like out here or in the corporate world. I am forced to stay because my healthcare is tied to my employment and I willingly take less pay so I can have PTO whenever I need it. That doesn't stop me from fighting for my fellow working class comrades.
>I dont think your way is possible. At least not anytime soon.
Thankfully, history doesn't agree with that statement.
TJR843 t1_jae3n12 wrote
Please note, I'm not trying to attack you in my responses. If it comes off that way, I apologize.
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