DoxxingShillDownvote t1_jd7jbak wrote on March 22, 2023 at 12:21 PM

Reply to comment by RafeDangerous in Apparently retirement communities are abusing ambulance services and decreasing availability for when other residents have emergencies by ShallowFreakingValue

> So you're in favor of yet more crippling medical billing for people?

No, I am in favor of predictable medical services that can respond when called. Not be paged from their jobs 2 and 3 times hoping you get enough people to show up. This isn't a game, it's people's lives. Want to keep medical bills down? REGIONALIZE!!!! not every town needs its own little ambulance service, own police, own schools, own fire. WAKE UP... it makes no sense, and is not sustainable, the way we do things today. The rest of medical bill shave to do with insurance... that's a bigger issue.

RafeDangerous t1_jd84kf8 wrote on March 22, 2023 at 2:57 PM

You haven't stumbled across a great new idea, you're asking for something that is literally helping to bankrupt people right now. Towns will NOT create their own funded regional EMS, they'll go with private contracted services or or services run by the hospitals and those are expensive. You say insurance will take care of it. Gee, great if you're insured, and if the EMS that picks you up takes your insurance.

Here's what happens when you get the paid ambulance services you think you want. I'll stick with our amazing volunteer services thanks.

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DoxxingShillDownvote t1_jd8y1hy wrote on March 22, 2023 at 6:03 PM

not town, . REGIONS... town in NJ are literally useless... and continually overspend on their own private police forces and own private schools. Regionalize and save money as well as lives. As for insurance... insurance is an issue, but I am not here to fight that fight. I am here to say that volunteer emergency services is idiotic

RafeDangerous t1_jd9lr8c wrote on March 22, 2023 at 8:32 PM

I don't care if you mean towns, regions, continents or stellar clusters, it will not happen. How do I know this? Because what I described isn't a hypothetical, it's what actually happens.

You're brushing off the issue of insurance as if it's not really relevant, but it's central to the whole issue which is in towns with volunteers the service is free and done by people who genuinely care, as opposed to people being charged thousands of dollars and provided by people who ironically often can't afford to be transported in their own ambulance is something happens to them.

Imagine calling a service run for the public good by volunteers "idiotic" and yet being completely ignorant of the consequences of your own staggeringly stupid "preference".

DoxxingShillDownvote t1_jd9pvtq wrote on March 22, 2023 at 8:59 PM

> I don't care if you mean towns, regions, continents or stellar clusters, it will not happen. How do I know this? Because what I described isn't a hypothetical, it's what actually happens.

Oh I know it will not happen. Because pig headed NJ towns won't give up their fiefdoms. You'd rather drowned in taxes and make grand speeches rather than regionalize schools, fire, police, ems.

> You're brushing off the issue of insurance as if it's not really relevant

Because it isn't. Not to this issue. I live in a part of NJ where we have actual, paid EMS. The ambulance comes when I call it. What a miracle. Can I or the city control insurance? No. Are we better off for having a public EMS? Yes.

You want to solve all of healthcare... I applaud you and we'd probably agree. I just want normal, functioning emergency response.

>Imagine calling a service run for the public good by volunteers "idiotic"

It is idiotic when it breaks down and no ambulance responds when called.

RafeDangerous t1_jdaa8gk wrote on March 22, 2023 at 11:18 PM

> Oh I know it will not happen. Because pig headed NJ towns won't give up their fiefdoms. You'd rather drowned in taxes and make grand speeches rather than regionalize schools, fire, police, ems.

We're talking about EMS and Fire, not police and schools. How exactly do you think volunteers who don't get paid for their time are driving up taxes by having them be town based? And before you say equipment, it'd be the same amount either way and it would be even more expensive because the volunteers do fundraising to cover part (or sometimes even all) of the cost. Firehouses service an area, you can't just close them all and send them from the "central" firehouse 40 minute away. Same goes for ambulances. Police have patrol areas so you could do that but, just in case you weren't aware of this, fire trucks and ambulances don't just cruise around looking for fires or patients. So, do tell, what are these great savings that you imagine could be had by switching to a paid, regionalized EMS or Fire service?

> Because it isn't. Not to this issue. I live in a part of NJ where we have actual, paid EMS. The ambulance comes when I call it. What a miracle. Can I or the city control insurance? No. Are we better off for having a public EMS? Yes.

This may be shocking to you, but...the exact same thing happens here only without the bill for however many thousands of dollars the ambulance company or hospital charges. I've lived in NJ for nearly 5 decades, always in towns with volunteer ambulance corps, and that's always been the case. If for some reason a crew can't be raised, one from a mutual aid town comes. And don't tell me that that "can't" happen with a paid squad, because it absolutely does. Economics dictates that they run as close to the minimum number of rigs as possible and sometimes that isn't enough and they need backup from another company or hospital. Further, EMS pays shit. It's embarrassing how low it is and they're having problems with both high churn rates and difficulty hiring so you know what happens? Empty rigs because there's no crew.

> You want to solve all of healthcare... I applaud you and we'd probably agree. I just want normal, functioning emergency response.

Yes, you're fucking right that we should "solve" healthcare. I just think it might be a good idea to do it before we do something that will make things objectively worse.

> It is idiotic when it breaks down and no ambulance responds when called.

And yet I never actually see that happening. But yeah, lets throw out a system that works and saves money for a clusterfuck nightmare that has people literally begging rescuers to call them an Uber for their crushed leg because that's preferable to them than adding to their already crushing bills. Great idea.

DoxxingShillDownvote t1_jdagjgy wrote on March 23, 2023 at 12:02 AM

> We're talking about EMS and Fire, not police and schools. How exactly do you think volunteers who don't get paid for their time are driving up taxes by having them be town based?

I am talking about all of it. You are not listening. I never said hometown based. But ya know, you keep missing the important bits. Details aren't your thing I guess.

>Economics dictates that they run as close to the minimum number of rigs as possible

I love it when people talk shite that they have no idea about. Taxes pay for manned squad. Regionalization helps costs be spread over multiple communities.

Or do it your way... Seems to be working so great... Amirite? You take care now