Was this behavior and culture like that with the wealthy Englishmen in the early 20th century?

Submitted by Upperphonny t3_y9gsut in history

There's a thing I've noticed with watching programs that deal with the wealthy class of English on around the 1920's and a bit onward. Shows like 'Brideshead Revisited' and 'Jeeves and Wooster' have the characters behave and live in a somewhat quirky manner. It's an almost care-free, childlike existence and culture. They often divulge in traditions, slang, and mannerisms that border on outlandish and esoteric. Example I can show is this scene here from 'Brideshead Revisited' and this scene from 'Jeeves and Wooster'. So was this sort of thing commonplace with the sort or just creative writing?

Much thanks!

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Cranscan87 t1_it5pyib wrote

I didn't having time to watch the entirety of the clips, but for what I saw and based solely on reading novels from the eras (not about, but from) yes, that more or less accurate.

Upper middle class men had clubs like the second clip and they had their own jargon (Brits always have and still do lol). And yes, bored second sons with wealth and time would get into great mischief... Not always so innocently either.

In the first clip, the first outlandish character would have been refered to as a Dandy. In some instances, a dandy is just a man who focused a lot on their appearance, but in most instances it was insinuating the man was a feminine gay- not something widely accepted in most cultures in history, no matter your status. Some circles of historical England (can't attest to America at the time) would tolerate a gay man if he kept it hidden and/or (probably more importantly) had connection to power families.

If any more versed historians (and most of you are lol) disagree, please be kind and share sources/suggestions as I'm always trying to read more!

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TimeEfficiency6323 t1_it6l6s3 wrote

Wait, wait, wait. The Drones are a very specific class of aristocratic younger sons. The older sons were being prepped for positions in running the estate, government, trade, the army etc. After those sons you had a bunch of sons who had no role, and lived idle lives on middling stipends.

At the time, open homosexuality was absolutely not tolerated. Campy is not the same as openly gay, but those who walked the line too closely would sometimes find themselves packed off to remote places and sometimes even married off under threat of being "cut off" - that is having their stipend withdrawn.

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LanewayRat t1_it6tr7w wrote

Yes this. I get the impression that an upper class male demeanour of those times was often tending towards a flamboyant, carefree, foppish, quirky and theatrical demeanour. Perhaps it fell out of favour in the more practical times of the Second World War and beyond. This doesn’t mean they were necessarily more gay but maybe a gay man might have been at home in this environment, if he kept his sexuality very private.

The negative side of this culture was that it was a privileged and rarefied existence, only sustainable amongst an elite who could afford to ignore the real world and be child-like and peculiar if they wanted to be.

This culture seems to live on, to some limited extent, in the British public school educated elite. To an Australian looking on from a distance, people like Boris Johnson and that Reece-Mogs (?) person seem ludicrously foppish and embarrassingly campy and extreme in many ways.

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TimeEfficiency6323 t1_itaxdxr wrote

A lot of it came to an end after World War I. Terrified by the idea of Bolshevism spreading westwards the UK government brought in the start of the social welfare system and paid for it with Income and Inheritance taxes.

Land became less of a guarantee of wealth and by World War II a number of the old estates had fallen into ruin. Meantime, family heads were having to cut off their wastrel sons.

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LaoBa t1_itmd3a9 wrote

Since 1900, 1,200 country houses have been demolished in England. In Scotland, 378 architecturally important country houses have been demolished,

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jezreelite t1_it6t46c wrote

Worth mentioning that Anthony in Brideshead Revisited is based on two real people: the writers Brian Christian de Claiborne Howard and Howard Acton.

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Upperphonny OP t1_it8bj2e wrote

I think everyone should encounter an Anthony once in their life. A colorful character for sure.

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Onetap1 t1_it8esl2 wrote

>Anthony Eden in Brideshead Revisited is based...

Anthony Blanche

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Doc_Eckleburg t1_it6wh14 wrote

Yes, the British public school system was programmed to ensure this world view was held by attendees to create a distinct sense of Britishness amongst the upper classes. It still exists, just look at Boris Johnson.

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Civil-Secretary-2356 t1_it7k6je wrote

Eccentric nobility has long been a thing. I don't know if the examples you give are typical but I'm certain they were not unknown. Added to this a number of them had few responsibilities until much later in life.

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Upperphonny OP t1_it82hi7 wrote

I just find this part of English society of the time fascinating and curious. They pretty much lived on a different world that's almost cryptic from most people. On the other hand you have the working class who couldn't have the time or luxury to do hardly any of that. The class divide structure of Britain has been a source of interest to me and it extended well into the military life there.

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ShalmaneserIII t1_ituesxo wrote

It seems to be pretty much inevitable when you have people who don't need to actually labor to live- they get eccentric, because nothing checks their behavior but their social group, and the whole social group has no checks at all on it.

Perhaps for a modern case, consider retired people with comfortable pensions- they get on Facebook and turn odd. Now picture an entire lifetime spent like that.

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AgoraiosBum t1_itmzzu2 wrote

There are some exaggerations for comic effect, but yes - there was an extensive amount of wealth leading to large incomes based mainly on rent and other investments, so that there was quite a lot of passive income flowing into the families. And many relatives would then receive an "allowance" that still left them quite well off so that they could afford fine clothes, club memberships, easy travel, and personal servants like a valet.

The wage structure and tax structure in the UK changed due to the world wars. There were still many wealthy families, but much less of a large support system with many family relations receiving an allowance, and so less of the "idle rich" that you see with Bertie Wooster and his crew.

But you can also see, in the same episode, the "working rich" shaking their head at Bertie not working. https://youtu.be/Te3SvM-aG04?t=1309

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