Walking parrotsGently_Rough_ t1_j6m1pro wrote
Reply to comment by Rabid_Kiwi in Walking parrots by FrankieGS
I’m sorry, what physiological damage is essential to the process?
Rabid_Kiwi t1_j6n6oby wrote
https://www.purdue.edu/uns/html4ever/2005/051221.Garner.parrots.html
I can do this all day. They need the flock, with out it they bond to one person. They can not be alone, they need a companion 24/7. When this is a human, and the human leaves for the day, it causes separation anxiety that turns in to mental illness. They will then start feather-pluck, and become progressively more hostile and violent.
They can’t be alone, it’s part of their evolution. That is why they mate for life. That is why you really need a team of people working with them. To stop them from ever being alone, also to prevent them from bonding with one human. Bonding with a human is bad because they think that they are human. They will stop wanting to socialize with other birds and primarily socialize with one human. Think of cray teenage obsession. Some even think that the feather-pluck is to make them look more human.
Most of them have personalities that lean towards vanity, appearance is very important to them. Think “small town what would the neighbors think” turned up to 11. Because again they are very social creatures, why they need the flock. Good keepers know to tell the birds and then groom them before guests or new people come. Yes they are that self aware!
This is why they can’t be raised in homes, as pets. They need open space to fly, they need a flock of their own kind, they need little to no human interaction. That is what they need. If you want to help volunteer/donate/create good bird sanctuaries near you. People who will train you and teach you how to give it the best life you can. If we invest the money used on them as house pets, into bird sanctuaries and rehabilitation. End the practice of them as pets, then we can really target poachers.
You just got to accept that we damage them any time we have contact with them. Because we don’t understand them, and they are very complex.
Gently_Rough_ t1_j6o11fj wrote
They shouldn’t be alone. My parrot was a rescue whose previous owner had died. What we did was to introduce him to another female as well as ensure he had companionship to more than one bond.
Believe me I know a lot about the impact depression has on birds, and that bond with a human is just showing what sensitive and loving animals they are. Would it not be true for dogs to be completely broken when their owner dies? They might not die from heartbreak - but how does that answer my question? The flame was that physiological damage is an ESSENTIAL part of having a bird as a pet, and I wasn’t clear on what that meant. This isn’t what you answered.
Rabid_Kiwi t1_j6o7vix wrote
The stress and anxiety from being away from the flock. The restrictions on movement and stunted social development. You need multiple birds not just two we are talking a flock. They need their community, and more room and freedom then a house or a yard. Just the same as if you took a two newborns to be raised by gorillas. Those children would have severe developmental and mental issues. That is what you are doing to them when you keep them as pets. When breeding in captivity the traits most needed for reintroduction are not passed on. They are less intelligent, and more prone to mental disorders than their wild counter parts. Because again they evolved with a flock, their very existence is the flock. They need it for social reinforcement, to show off how good they look, to feel safe from perdition, because they evolved that way.
I was trying to sugarcoat it but it’s like this. You can feed a kid all candy and never make them go to school for 18 years. Yeah the kid is happy, for now, but it’s not what the kid needs. Think of all the issues that kid is going to have. They never learned self discipline, how to act around others, that there are others their age, limited communication, no chance at finding a mate, not even able to be accepted in society.
Ok so understanding what they need, and realizing that not giving them what they need stunts their development. Makes them more prone to mental disorders such as depression, anxiety, separation anxiety, PTSD, aggression, and probably many more. Probably (imho) to serve as a incentive in the wild to move on and search for a new flock, if ever isolated. But that last one is just my crack pot speculation, so grain of salt.
The research showing this is so prevalent you can just google it to find it. I don’t think you all realize how incredibly intelligent and conscious these birds really are. They have very good problem solving, very good memory, and very good rationality. They learn our language fam, this tells us they have their own language. They understand language fam, as in the concept. They understand that they need to communicate with us, they recognize we use language, they teach themselves our language. I’m not talking about them speaking to us, I’m talking mainly about us speaking to them. You need to understand they deliberately do this. It is a choice they make, and they can do it wicked fast.
Ok you take that type of intelligence, that evolved to be communal, and take it from its societal grounds and it environment. You are going to cause developmental issues and mental illness if born in captivity, or mental illness if captured. Same as us fam, only their social instincts are turned up to 11.
MisogynyisaDisease t1_j6n3e7k wrote
Theyre intelligent, and can become depressed or even go insane while in captivity.
If you got placed in a cage for years with nobody to talk to, and you couldn't go for a walk by yourself or find love, how exactly would you fare?
Sure, there are lots of good bird owners out there who do their best. But for every good bird owner, I knew 5 more growing up who just threw a sheet over their way-to-small bird cage to shut up their parrot.
Gently_Rough_ t1_j6o0hfw wrote
So, no physiological cruelty is essential to the process then?
MisogynyisaDisease t1_j6o59ed wrote
Seeing as they aren't domesticated, and you're basically rewiring them to live solo and not nest in large broods. Yeah, I'd say it's pretty essential. There's no getting around it, there is a cruelty element to keeping wild animals as pets. You not being intentionally cruel doesn't really change that.
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