Submitted by RedTomatoSauce t3_zu69z4 in gifs
briefnuts t1_j1hemab wrote
15 Oktober 1944, Aachen, Germany
TertiumNonHater t1_j1hrpm2 wrote
Straight to the top. The first German city taken by the Allies. Very intense urban combat. The Germans had a habit of hiding in and ambushing from basements— so Shermans would blast houses starting from the bottom and up floor after floor. One round was said to have gone through three houses before exploding in the fourth.
(Not so) fun fact: German civilians were afraid to evacuate to Cologne because there was a rumor that the Allies had dropped biological weapons there.
Aachen doesn't get much coverage, seeing the pic brought into frame made me very happy.
type-username_here t1_j1hzey9 wrote
My grandpa was there, he told me about once. He said they would move in small groups and throw a grenade down the cellar stairs first when clearing houses. He rarely talked about the war because of PTSD, the stories he told me about fighting in Germany were intense, close up brutal combat.
Bleedthebeat t1_j1idze9 wrote
I’ve heard from a few veteran friends of mine say that they don’t talk about war, not because of the trauma, but because of the way their friends and family look at them as if they are either damaged or heartless afterwards.
type-username_here t1_j1ifi3j wrote
When my Grandpa told me about it, it was just kind of out of nowhere. I had just finished doing some plumbing work at his house and he was writing me a check for the supplies, and just started telling me stories about the war. He just had a thousand mile stare and you could tell he could see these events replaying in his head as he told them to me. He told me about killing men from only feet away, and how he covered himself in debris as a German tank rolled over a trench he was in, he said he was shot at directly from an 88. He said everyone he fought alongside was killed, he spent 32 days in front line combat and collapsed from battle fatigue. He said he woke up in a hospital in Paris and cried tears of joy to be out of that hell.
Silua7 t1_j1ikwar wrote
Hearing stories like these really helps understand why they always thought us grandkids are soft. We were all born in the long summer.
Erlian t1_j1iptbs wrote
Born in a long summer in some ways. Though in other ways we face threats just as existential/ if not more so, more complex, and with no escape in sight, and things just keep getting worse. No war can solve what we face now.
We have to rely on the dwindling political will in our polarized and eroding democracy. A young electorate that is tough and hardworking, and better educated than ever, yet understandably disenchanted and depressed / anxious about the state of our democracy and the world.
News outlets that peddle fear over truth. A global pandemic. Fascism rearing its ugly head on our own home turf, in our lifetimes, along with treasonous actions from our own elected leaders. Monopolies and conglomerates that have eroded both policy and the free market - including pharma, healthcare, and health insurance. A climate disaster hundreds of years in the making.
Animal_Courier t1_j1iv2rr wrote
If it gives you any hope those tough, hardworking, better educated people you mentioned are coming up with a ton of potential solutions to climate change - better renewables, better batteries, more efficient tech and more efficient systems. Even without international cooperation scientists around the world are dragging us off the precipice of a climate catastrophe.
Which is not to say the climate won’t change, or that people won’t be harmed during this process, but it is being mitigated. As a fantastic cherry on top the United States passed an enormous climate change hill that has already inspired huge investments in the green revolution. The world tends to follow American trends, and with only a few exceptions voters around the world are demanding their politicians take part in the solution.
Though I do foresee the possibility of great and terrible times ahead, I do not think they are inevitable, probable or even likely unless we let some of these bad actors use law and politics to wipe away our gains (aka Americans can fuck it up if they give too much power to Republicans, as that party is currently constituted). Humanity is pushing forward through these stormy times. Try not to despair, that which is good in this word is not yet lost, not nearly, and billions of your fellow humans are fighting to keep it, improve it and thrive.
Erlian t1_j1jy8qm wrote
Thank you for this message :) the Inflation Reduction Act was huge for green energy investment + I'm glad we're moving towards more renewables and EVs. No sense in despairing and we must keep working hard and moving forward!
Slexx t1_j1jgqrs wrote
if you think jan 6 and infowars is as bad as (if not worse) than WW2 you really need to turn off MSNBC and touch grass
Erlian t1_j1jyf84 wrote
That's not what I was saying at all, silly goose :) happy holidays & keep warm
gnomz t1_j1kd387 wrote
You must be high, the 'threats' in 2022 are nothing compared to 2 empires simultaneously waging brutal wars in an attempt to conquer the globe
Old_Passage_5670 t1_j1j9row wrote
Love hearing these stories God bless him!!
Fuckredditadmins117 t1_j1l1arq wrote
My father was in Vietnam and I had the exact same experience with him. Just out of the blue like it was playing in his head. Worst part is him and the friends he lost have never been acknowledged as having been in the conflict due to some shady government shit and an NDA. So not only has he had to live through that he has been accused of false honour for even mentioning it. But having met a few veterans of combat you can't fake that retelling, when you see them it's clearly real and running in their head.
KaHOnas t1_j1iesrx wrote
It's weird describing combat to someone who hasn't been there. I don't need comforting, I just get strange looks when I describe things I've done or what I was thinking of doing.
P4_Brotagonist t1_j1j76hz wrote
It's weird because many people have this "idea" in their head of what combat or fighting is, but in reality it's basically nothing like that. Try describing being stuck up halfway up on a massive hillside in a valley taking shots from enemy like 400 meters away on the opposite hill trying to hit you with their irons while you move around and also return fire in the slowest process known to man. People think of combat as some sort of "yeah you see the guy and then you shoot him and then it's over and you win!" They don't realize it's like a half an hour process that feels like 5 hours while you awkwardly maneuver around what somehow always seems to be the most cluttered area of your life and then suddenly it's "over."
8ad8andit t1_j1ihq33 wrote
It seems like it's pretty common for people that do horrible things when they're in wartime conditions for a long time.
I suspect that a lot of police officers in the United States have a similar thing going on; a kind of PTSD from dealing with violent people regularly.
Do you have any thoughts about that? I'd be curious for your opinion since you have actual experience of this and I don't.
Bleedthebeat t1_j1ijhpa wrote
I don’t think you can compare police officers in the us to soldiers in war. The media and our society in general makes being a police officer seem like a much more dangerous job than it actually is. Sure the threat is there and that is worthy of respect for their willingness to take that risk but in nyc at least something like 95% of officers will go their entire career without ever having to fire a shot. Part of why officers are rarely punished for shooting someone is precisely because it happens so rarely that they’re not expected to really know how to handle the situation. No amount of training is going to adequately prepare you for how you’ll react to a threat on your life when adrenaline takes over
8ad8andit t1_j1irrog wrote
Well I think it varies in different locations. Areas with deep poverty have a lot more violence than other places.
But otherwise PTSD doesn't come from drawing your gun out of its holster.
It doesn't even come necessarily from violence happening to you.
It comes from being in situations where you fear for your life.
Cops who work very poor and violent neighborhoods are experiencing that everyday.
Trust me, I've lived in neighborhoods where gunshots were a daily occurrence, and even automatic rifles could be heard occasionally. It scared me just to hear it, and I'm not even the one getting the phone call to go check it out every time it happens. That's what cops have to do.
As usual I'm going to get downvoted for daring to suggest that maybe cops could use some empathy.
Unfortunately, the only way to improve human beings is to first empathize and understand what's actually on their plate.
The idea that cops are just this special breed of bad human beings, is stupid. And as long as that is the predominant belief system, nothing will ever change. There will just be this feud that never ends and hurts all of us.
Bleedthebeat t1_j1j36l7 wrote
I never said or even implied that they are bad people. Sure I know that sentiment is popular on reddit but that’s not at all the point I was trying to make.
And your points above about the inner city officers. That’s because their departments have failed them by never rotating them out of that environment. Those officers need to spend time in an area with less criminal activity to avoid the problem of seeing all citizens as criminals.
All of our problems with the police could be solved internally but the problem is both sides see themselves as being attacked. In some circumstances that seems justified but we seem to have gone away from the days where officers of the law were tasked with serving the commmunity and are now in the mindset of its us against them.
Fishamble t1_j1izpls wrote
I am not from the US, but from the outside the population have a terrible relationship with the police. Going by reddit it appears they recieve no respect, which is nescessary for them to be an affective force.
NotTRYINGtobeLame t1_j1iky5q wrote
I am not a combat veteran, but I have been forward deployed in the Navy. If it's hard for me to explain what happens during a deployment to friends and loved ones, holy fucking shit... I can't imagine how hard it would be for an actual combat vet to talk about it.
TheDocJ t1_j1jyw8n wrote
Many years ago, a terminally ill patient of my ex gave her his A4 notebook/ sketchbook of his combat experiences, and I had a look through it.
He had fought at Monte Cassino, there were pen-and-ink sketches of his comrades sheltering in some of the ruins or a tank going over the rubble, and things like that. He showed it to my ex because he said his family weren't interested in it and would just throw it away once he had died, I think she did give it back to him in the end but i suggested he offered it to the Imperial War Museum. I hope it did get preserved.
enraged768 t1_j1jvj72 wrote
It's hard to talk about because it seems absolutely ridiculous to most people. The only people you can honestly talk about with are other war veterans.
[deleted] t1_j1j83ip wrote
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Beizelby t1_j1l5ooh wrote
Yes.
Experiencing actual combat, not training, changes a person forever no matter how people want to try and explain it.
The passing of time has a way of changing everyone.
TertiumNonHater t1_j1i5k34 wrote
Your grandfather took part in a historically significant battle. White phosphorus grenades and flamethrowers were also used. The allies used AP rounds to shoot through floors and ceilings and would make a dash to the top floor of a building and work their way down— forcing the Germans into a basement. The allies found it safer to shoot bazooka rounds and use explosives to blast entryways known as "mouse holing". This lesson was learned and applied later by soldiers engaged in urban combat in Vietnam— even today as noted in the Baghdadi compound raid.
The German force holding the city was about 18,000 strong. Some of the personnel used as infantry were originally Kriegsmarine intended to crew U-boats (funny how history rhymes, given the use of Navy crews by Russia).
TinFoilRobotProphet t1_j1irs9l wrote
My Grandfather never talked about it either. He did have his scotch and smokes every day though.
JAYCEE-- t1_j1irxz5 wrote
It’s crazy how we as people fight like this. We all live on the same damn planet. It is what it is I guess.
vile_things t1_j1i3ws1 wrote
After the occupation their mayor was assassinated by a werewolf commando. Their aim was to make Germans afraid to collaborate with the Allies but this stands out as one of the few actual, successful missions they undertook.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Franz_Oppenhoff
One of my favourite factoids about Aachen is how the Nazis tried to remove the enormous bronze gates of the Aachen cathedral (cast around the year 800), among other relics, to get them out of allied hands. But the gates were too well built in and they had to give up.
TertiumNonHater t1_j1i6cpi wrote
That is really interesting. Speaking of the werewolf teams, which I believe were the idea of Otto Skorzeny (I could be wrong), there were a few instances where allies found cables strung across the road intended as a trap for jeep crews. This lead to them placing posts at the front of the jeep such as this one.
Sfumatographer t1_j1ijxx9 wrote
Fighters trying to oust the Dutch from Indonesia (1940s) used the same trick. Lots of beheadings happened because usually the front windows were kept collapsed. Fun fact: thé Indonesians won freedom after 300 years of colonial rule and Sukarno became its president.
DarthWeenus t1_j1ibv0i wrote
Wild
vile_things t1_j1j19n5 wrote
Interesting. I had never heard about this before. Reminds me a little of the Rommelspargel (Rommel's asparagus). War makes for odd sights.
NotTRYINGtobeLame t1_j1iknrb wrote
>werewolf commando
Heh. I was doing some quick reading about them, and they were trained at Schloss Hülchrath. If you go to their current website (the castle, not the werewolves lol) - and use Google translate - you get this greeting:
>Schloss Hülchrath is the perfect place for your celebration. As soon as you enter this extraordinary event location, you will not be able to escape the fascination of the history of bygone times. The desire to discover more is awakened and rewarded.
I know it's a tiny skid mark on the history of that castle, but I still chuckled at the unfortunate context of that when I looked it up.
Potato_Muncher t1_j1ian2m wrote
I'm fairly positive this was the battle where the Americans had to use a 155mm self-propelled gun to knock out German positions inside large, old buildings. The Sherman's 75/76mm guns couldn't penetrate the thick stone facades, so they resorted to open-sight artillery instead. The Germans were pretty pissed about it's use and wanted the practice to be outlawed.
TertiumNonHater t1_j1ibwxx wrote
You are correct! Here is a M12 Gun Motor Carriage in action in Aachen.
I am having a hard time finding the quote (so take it with a grain of salt), but I recall a German commander in Aachen saying something along the lines of "when the Americans begin to use artillery as sniper fire— you have lost."
[deleted] t1_j1iyqsz wrote
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PlayMp1 t1_j1iv75w wrote
The US was known for incredibly rapid, widespread, and accurate use of artillery in WW2. The Soviets might have taken a half hour to line up artillery after it's been requested for defensive support fire (to their credit, the Eastern Front was vastly larger than the Western, and they had less industrial capacity than the US), and the Germans maybe 15 minutes. Because of extensive planning work and the most incredible feats of logistics work in history, the US could do it in 2 minutes, sometimes as low as 30 seconds.
zegg t1_j1ji97r wrote
Well, guess it's true what they say - men win battles, but logistics win wars.
Amedais t1_j1in4a3 wrote
That really is just like the old COD campaign haha.
Duckboy_Flaccidpus t1_j1ityfl wrote
When you get pissed enough and just want to end the battle yet make a statement.
EverydayPoGo t1_j1i5rcp wrote
Does your second paragraph imply that these could be civilians who were hiding in the basements when houses were blasted?
TertiumNonHater t1_j1i81vv wrote
From what I've read, the Germans prior to the battle had pulled civilians out starting with children. It was noted that they simply dropped a bunch of kids off just east outside of the city. They later rushed in and began escorting out elderly and women— who were horrified to see the soldiers immediately fortifying their houses with concrete and such as they were escorted out.
That's not to say there weren't civilians left in the city. It's interesting to note that Hitler had ordered the evacuation of the city because he suspected the population preferred American occupation because allied bombing would cease. Generalleutenant Gerhard Graf von Schwerin had paused the evacuation and appealed to the allies to treat the populace "mercifully". Word got out to Hitler that he did this and ordered him arrested— but surprisingly forgave him later. As far as I know, the Germans resumed the evacuation of civilians and that it was enforced pretty "harshly".
Tarwah t1_j1inzdc wrote
It‘s at the Kaiserplatz, isn‘t it? Lived in Aachen for 10 years and think I recognize this house.
lavahot t1_j1j8pca wrote
Boy, that gate held up pretty well.
Quirky-Ad5417 t1_j1j0brn wrote
Wow, I was there about three weeks ago. Beautiful Christmas market in the old town square. I was looking around at the buildings and I notices the limestone frame around the doors of old buildings have bullet holes in them.
Kinda shocking when you're standing there and realized what happened.
It's a wonderful town BTW.
[deleted] t1_j1hzymz wrote
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trashyman2004 t1_j1ll78k wrote
Great video, with lots of now/then footage
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