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Wait for the new AMD cards in December. Why buy an expensive fire hazard made by Nvidia?

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MSRP Means Nothing Anymore

I just got a 3080 non-ti brand new for less than MSRP and I'm sure it's the last Nvidia ill buy for a few cycles.

But I also won't upgrade it for a few years, its plenty.

And here I am still using my 960, I need to start saving up.

Edit: Putting the 4080 benchmark into my first comment since people are asking for source on the raster estimate which is fair https://videocardz.com/newz/nvidia-geforce-rtx-4080-overclocking-and-4k-gaming-benchmarks-leaked

These 4080 benchmarks are from tech outlets that already have the card and should be pretty accurate and it's hitting numbers right around what AMD claims the XTX can do. Personally if the 4080 is really trading blows with the XTX I'd pay $200 more for better RT and DLSS3.

MSRP for GPUs is basically just for the FE and maybe a few low end AIBs. It's always been this way where if you buy a nicer AIB model the prices increase from the base MSRP.

I will just wait for the Ryzen 7950X3D and go for a full AMD build.

And your source is?

https://videocardz.com/newz/nvidia-geforce-rtx-4080-overclocking-and-4k-gaming-benchmarks-leaked

4080 benchmarks are getting leaked and should be fairly accurate. It's hitting numbers right around what AMD is claiming with the XTX.

Wait for the 5k series, buy 3k or 4k under MSRP. Was always a great deal. You won't even need more performance during that time, as there are only a heck ton of mediocre unity and other type of indie "developed" games out there.

The AMD presentation..? They laid out the numbers and you can pretty easily draw conclusions based on them. He's probably wrong about the 7900XTX matching the 4080 - the 7900XTX is faster.

He's right about RT though, the 7900XTX matches the 3090/3090Ti in that department, so will be quite a bit behind the 4080.

Don’t think that’s true. The rasteration is better than 4080 by significant margin. But the RT is not as good.

Why would you waste your money on a 4080 when a $999 AMD card will outperform it? This thing isn't worth $1200, and it sure as hell ain't worth $1600! AT BEST, this should be a $900 card!

>Want to buy an RTX 4080?

No.

You don't have benchmarks on either, so your assumption is just that. But based on what we know, the XTX should be SIGNIFICANT faster than the 4080 in raster, ESPECIALLY if you get an AIB card that pumps up the power to 450 watts!

For RT, we will have to just wait for actual numbers. As for DLSS? AMD has FSR, and while DLSS might have a SLIGHT edge in overall quality, you have to strain to see the differences in most of the comparisons I have seen. Buying overpriced hardware because of a SOFTWARE feature is ludicrous in any case.

That’s a lot of money to spend when you can get a book of matches for free and burn your house down the same way.

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Still new to the pc scene, what does aib and fe mean? Sorry if dumb question still trying to learn

I’m feeling very good about my Evga hybrid 3080 for $800 atm.

Maybe next year on the 40 series.

FE = Founders edition = Cards made by their designer (Nvidia/AMD/Intel)

AIB = Add in board partner = Cards made by everyone else than their designer (Nvidia/AMD/Intel)

And get fire insurance

Oh god we’ve slipped back into the Nvidia/AMD Coke/Pepsi flame wars lol

to me it's nuts people are spending $1k on a graphics card. it's a shame the industry has gone this way. but I get it, people will spend that money, and nvidia and amd both are more than willing to give them something to spend it for.

Guess im going to AMD for my next card.

I’m on the 1070 Ti still and am likely to just go AMD next year when I finally build a new PC and sell my current one

But with the demand, will I be able to get one at Best Buy or Microcenter? I need more pixels on Custom Order Maid 2.

Someone needs to tell nVidia that the crypto rush is over and they can go back to normal pricing now...

Honestly, I don't care if they DO have a performance advantage...nVidia's anti-consumer actions over the past few years pushed me away from EVER considering one of their products!

>MSRP for GPUs is basically just for the FE and maybe a few low end AIBs. It's always been this way where if you buy a nicer AIB model the prices increase from the base MSRP.

Yeah except this time any performance gained from AIBs are neglible as the FE SKUs are already tuned near peak performance. I welcome anyone to justify buying the Asus ROG Strix 4090 (and likely 4080) versus the others. This was EVGA's chief complaint - Nvidia is treating the AIBs like a nuisance [to be crushed] rather than partners

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Headline purposefully misleading

"Come on, it's only the price of a cheap used car!" lol

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It's that or nothing. This is what happens if you have essentially no competition. Two companies is not a competition - it's a mutual jackoff.

The wafer/chip is likely 1/5th of the GPU final price.

Holyshit I thought I was going crazy.... i did read your comment correctly the first time as it turns out.

What a guy

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How is your 960 these days? I'm about to build my son's first computer and I plan on using a 960 for his GPU since its essentially a starter build. Was able to get it for like 25 bucks from a friend, so im hoping its good, but if it isn't its not a huge waste.

How about just not buying it. Anybody thought of that before?

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Partners have always had more expensive cards than the reference. The problem now is that even the OC cards from the partners aren’t as good as the FE cards.

Same. None of the 40 series tbh. Nvidia is like Apple now in my opinion. I‘ll only buy if my stuff breaks down. And not the newest stuff either.

And if either or both think they will make sure their stuff breaks on purpose after some time? Will leave them behind completely. In their segments they seem to have too much influence/power and abuse it to nobody’s surprise I guess.

I‘m also over all the AAA games that are just trying to rip the players off nowadays. Indy games really have become so much better and more interesting (and won’t hopefully need a 40s for a long time lol ).

Rant over. Sorry.

Nope, my 2070 does just fine

Fuck nVidia. I'm waiting until December 13th for the new Radeons. If they perform anywhere near spec, you'd have to be insane to buy a 4080/4090.

>AMD Radeon RX 7900 Series graphics cards are expected to be available from AMD.com beginning December 13, 2022, and from leading board partners including ASRock, ASUS, Biostar, Gigabyte, MSI, PowerColor, Sapphire, Vastarmor, XFX and Yeston beginning mid-December. The AMD Radeon RX 7900 XTX has an SEP of $999 USD, while the AMD Radeon RX 7900 XT has an SEP of $899 USD.

what is the pricing have anything to do with micro center?

Because if I had money to burn and use Ray Tracing..

Or

There are some productive apps that Nvidia is just vastly superior

I just upgraded my 1050ti to a 3060 I scored locally for $210.

I game occasionally so there is no way I am dropping 1k on a GPU

The 1050ti held its own

I’m gonna jump on AMD or Intel train for the next one homies. Maybe I go AMD CPU+GPU or Intel for that theme. I’m getting sick of NVIDIA shenanigans.

Nope...

Have you met consumers?

They spend crazy money on tons of stuff.

Going to miss evga. The only AIB card I would buy. Customer service and warranty was amazing.

No it hasnt, AIBs used to complain on there razer thin margins on cards like the premium 1660Tis when NVDA cared about MSRP, They can restrict supply to AIBs which is basically a death sentenece but NVDA doesnt care anymore, thats why AMD cards are below MSRP for AIBs because they care.

1k isn’t what it used to be though 😅

Id only buy a 4090 if it came with a free air conditioner.

Look at mr moneybags who can afford a used car!

Want to buy one? I do not.

Also driver support and software are just better on Nvidia, unfortunately. This has been one of the things that keeps me away from amd. I dealt with their drivers and software for a like 10 years and I just don't want to anymore.

Top end AIB cards never made any sense performance to price. The base versions and FE always were way better if you cared about the value.

Most of the extras don't really make the card any where near faster % wise for the % increase. Lower temps , better looking, form factor type stuff is nice but meh.

I don’t play too many high fidelity games (because my CPU is the pits) but it has held up well for years now, I don’t plan on losing it just yet.

That’s why I proposed this innovative idea nobody has ever had before me. 👍

I can wait for this generation of Nvidia cards to crash and burn...they're already doing the latter

I mean that's all speculation. Time will tell. If so the 4080 won't sell well. Though it seems like Nvidia priced the 4080 to sell more 4090s honestly so idk if they care.

Typically it's every 2 years for a generation

They typically offer the best deals you'll ever get for CPU and MB. And most items trade blows with everywhere else depending who's got it on sale this week. Though microcenter limits the good deals to in person typically only which does suck and id knock them down a tad for that but there not anywhere near as bad as you're saying.

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What $999 card outperforms the 4080 (which we dont even have third party benchmarks for yet)

Ah okay thank you so much!! I have seen those both a bunch and am always afraid to ask! Much appreciated!

Merely a Suggestion Retailers... idk I'm having a hard time coming up with a word that accurately describes their price gouging tactics in one word that starts with the letter 'p'... a bit harder than initially I imagined 🤔
I'mma leave it up to reddit; yall figure it out! 🤷‍♂️✌

No, Nvidia isn't like Apple. Nvidia genuinely sells better stuff, Apple sells pretty stuff to people who don't know, or don't care.

Nvidia is going to be holding the bag on this one if AMDs GPUs are even 75 to 80 percent of their performance.

The price inflation, size of the cards, and the power draw issues all contribute to making end users leery of investing into such an expensive item.

So if you can get something that's half the price and most of the performance? Why not. Especially when it'll fit in your case and isn't melting power cables.

Lets agree to disagree then.

I fucking wish I could buy a running used car for $1600.

Lol no thx

Which card outperforms it?

I got a $460 used RTX 3080 a week or two ago. I was skeptical, but I benchmarked her and she runs exactly at spec! 😁
I know $460 isn't chump change in this economy, but the card still sells new for $799.99, and used it's still easily $550-650 so I think I did alright 🤷‍♂️
Like everyone in here is saying tho; it's bewildering what people are willing to pay for high end specs.
This is my first technical 'high end' gpu purchase and with how the market is looking; I'll be holding onto her for a loooooong time before my next upgrade. And even then I'll be seeking the used market.
I was getting by fine with a used GTX 1650 Super before this that played most of the indie titles I like no problem, and most every recent release at 1080p medium/high settings (some games did run horribly however and my rig was starting to show signs of age, but most of those games I could turn a setting or few down and she'd be running like a dream again).
I only got this to play Elden Ring at 1440p with a decent FPS and to go back and play the meme of a game Cyber Punk since I payed for it and haven't touched it since release.
Overall tho if I wasn't able to snag a decent price like I did; I woulda stood with that 1650. I had a bond with that card; it was oddly fun seeing what games she could play and tuning the settings to fit her spec everytime I launched up a new title. That and there's a different level of satisfaction you get when you kick the enemy teams ass on mid/potato spec computers. It's like a double ego boost for yourself. 'I'm so good at the game I could beat you with 15-30fps' 😬😂
Edit: To go more off what you were saying tho; more people definitely need to consider AMD. I had a RX 580 I no longer needed that I gave to my sister for graphic design; and it still holds up nicely at 1080p medium/high with modern games in 2022.
If I didn't give that to her cause I scored another rig with that 1650 I mentioned for the low; I woulda still been using that.
AMD > Nvidia when it comes to buying new. But if you can buy used and get a deal on an Nvidia card; don't feel like that's a bad option. They're great cards for gaming; just a tad overpriced putting it mildly.
I will say tho; most AMD products are moreso better in raw specs which only translate to gains in performance in environments like rendering software and synthetic benchmarks.
It's kinda the reason why people still lean Nvidia/Intel if they can get their hands on em when they're tryna build a gaming rig... well that and historically 'better' driver support. But that's subjective and AMD seems to be doing a better job over the years supporting older GPU's so that point can be taken with a grain of salt.
All that being said; AMD is a great alternative for the price to performance they offer. Increasingly so because of the price gouging companies like Nvidia are guilty of.

Maybe I'm getting old but I can't justify the cost on it; video games that require that power I just end up watching like movies lol. For everything else there's mastercard, mid series cards that are already overkill.

And I guess people who need it for their jobs?

Just buy the 7000 series

Misleading headline.

Stands for Massively Serious Ripping Pain and is usually localised to the wallet/arse.

7900XTX

Oh, you mean another card that we dont have third party benchmarks for?

Yeah i'll just stick to my watercooled 3080 which runs every game on max settings at least 60 FPS, I think i'll survive.

Literally did a torture test with Cyberpunk 2077 and the only setting not maxed was raytracing I believe I put on preferring performance. Still looks absolutely gorgeous, especially when it rains. Get a pretty rock solid 60 FPS.

This is pretty much the 30 series scalping prices all over again, except now it's the company and the retailers doing it lmao.

Prepare your anus

Yeah the only point of going for AIBs now seems to be for lower fan noise, cooling, and look/build quality if you care about that but even then the FE models have caught up in those departments. Personally probably gonna try and get a 4080 FE next year when prices on it inevitably drop once RTX 30 supply clears.

4090 FE has been getting great reviews so far from tech outlets and I expect it will be the same for the 4080 FE. Nvidia has really stepped up the design quality of their FE cards in recent years. It does suck that it seems like they're disregarding their AIB partners at this point but for consumers its nice to have a good quality FE option at MSRP.

Wouldn't be surprised to see them return in the future if market conditions change, maybe as a partner for AMD or Intel even though they kind of denied that option when they were asked about it a couple months ago.

yeah, 4 of the cards are at MSRP and then go up from there.

Such a based guy. Can't compete.

And actually only $1200 in this case.

Because the software I use runs better with Nvidia cards.

How do you know these aren't priced at MSRP? They start at Nvidia's MSRP and it's possible that other manufacturers are just pricing their cards higher, like they've done in the past.

Same. I went to Intel/Nvidia for personal setups around 10+ years ago after dealing with ATI shit drivers and shit hdcp support for years. A few years later I built a PC just to sell and make a few bucks and went with AMD stuff. It was still garbage at that time. I will recommend AMD cpu's, but never recommend AMD gpu's. I have seen people talking about shitty drivers on their last two generations of cards, but I don't have any personal experience. Maybe they have gotten a lot better and people are not experiencing too many issues, but my taste for Radeon has been soured. I am willing to pay a premium for system stability. I don't want to go back to the days where I have to fuck around with a bunch of shit to get a game to run.

Have you seen food prices lately? Its not just the gfx industry.

4k VR or triple 4k monitors for people playing racing and flight sims. Those can utilize the performance from a 4090. Most of the people with those setups have money to spend and don't care about the cost of a 4090 when their sim rig alone costs $5k+.

Good luck.

As long as people buy Madden every year...

There will be the same people paying out the nose for GPUs to play Fortnite

My son had a RX580 and it ran pretty good on lastest drivers... But now he has a 3050... And it's been smooth since day one (granted I bought it 3 months ago)

Good point, didnt think of them

I would hope they have gotten the drivers squared away after 5 years. This link below is the stuff I have been reading about AMD cards for years and I will think to myself "glad I don't have to deal with that". In this link people are talking about how you have to under clock the RX580 to get it to work right and this was 8 months ago. You should never have to do anything like that to get your GPU to work. I think I was reading a few weeks ago about people having problems with the 5000 series cards when they released. Again, maybe this is just a small minority of people and in general the drivers are fine, but I sure as hell don't want to spend money on a gpu knowing I might have to deal with a bunch of shit. I can't think of one time in the last 10 years I got a bad nvidia driver that caused my computer to malfunction

​

**edit to add link**

​

.https://www.reddit.com/r/radeon/comments/tjlbaj/rx580_drivers_are_a_nightmare/

I always thought that FE cards were for some reason way more expensive than others.

Apple sells both pretty and very high quality stuff though lol. The real people who “don’t know” are people who still think about Apple like they’re living in 2010

That’s what I’m doing. I’m just so damn confused about AMDs naming scheme lol

I'm expecting a price drop when the 7900xt/xtx releases, no way 4080s will move at that price if performance is comparable.

What kind of insane people would buy a 4080 or 4070ti when the AMD cards will be there for far less? If you don’t care about money and want the Best, Buy the 4090. For the rest go red

New shortage because the stupid 16 pin is burning with too many gpus needed for RMA cases. Some AIBs want to first sort out the issue then sell guaranteed high rma rates of gpus which causes even less supply.

Small supply so prices rise. Even if the demand wouldn't be that big.

A fool and their money are soon parted. You have to be special kind of person to spend the $$$ on this GPU.

Hey Intel is trying don't count them out. Honestly though I just seen a review saying the Intel gpus have almost no slowdown when Ray tracing

Lol you can

Maybe Shop Refurbished Product.

At least, I will.

> It's that or nothing.

What are you talking about? There are lots of GPUs in prices ranging from $200 all the way up to those obnoxious prices.

There have always been obnoxiously overpriced options for those looking to stroke their e-peen. It used to be SLI builds, then Titan cards, now xx90.

Oufff I'm anxious about the programmation of all these gpu... imagine that almost Quadro 5000 into a game card all in programmation include

I’ve seen people do ray traces on 386s in high school. Took overnight to generate, but the point is. Intel has a lot of data on this process over those years. GPU makers have just only delved into ray tracing. This is the 3rd generation and frankly both have again made incremental improvements rather than producing a breakthrough product. Perhaps to keep selling GPUs.

There are no video games that actually require that power.

7900 XTX should handily outperform the 4080 in raster...but we will have to wait for the benchmarks.

FE is a newer thing so I don't know what always could mean short of a couple years. Nvidia cards always sucked in comparison up until lately

Not true these days, drivers are just as stable on AMD as Nvidia

https://wccftech.com/amd-most-stable-graphics-drivers/

That may or may not be true, but MC has several listed at or near MSRP.

​

https://www.microcenter.com/search/search_results.aspx?N=4294966937+4294805556&NTK=all&sortby=pricelow

Path tracing is the new holly grail. Abit different then ray tracing, alot more complex, and physically accurate.

The big push now for dlss and other ai based upscaling I think is silly, why fake a high res picture when you could use ai to accelerate path tracing and other raw features and render at true high res and high performance.

Dlss reminds me of 3d tv's, and 200 Hz tv's, just a sales gimmick. Which is what Ray tracing currently is to.

Sorry but the same was said about the drivers that I was on back when I formed that opinion. Not mention the software itself being junk.

Also that article is from 2018.

GTX 970 for the win.

FE is typically only used to refer to Nvidia cards afaik

This account must be a bot karma farming. Check it’s history.

>It's always been this way where if you buy a nicer AIB model the prices increase from the base MSRP.

Don’t pretend it was always like this lol used to be 70-100 markup maybe a little more. Did you read the article? They’re talking 400 fucking dollars above FE prices it has certainly not “always been that way”

I have a choice to pay my 6-month rent or buy a new GPU

Yes, that is correct. AMD doesn't have a special name for it and Intel calls them Limited Edition.

So is it safe to assume the FE type cards are better/safer purchases since it’s directly from the designer? Or is that not a good thought process?

Not exactly no. Think of it like a stock car while the AIB's (sadly slowly not anymore) are tweaked "racing" models. EVGA was the prime example of this where they would tweak their cards faster than stock.

The stock car is fine and probably cheaper but that racing model will be faster and have things like NOS and bucket seats.

Also the company that covers your warranty for AIBs are those companies and not NVidia. The direct car example would be if your dealership would repair your car for you as per warranty instead of the factory it came from.

I did say base cards first and FE. And FE cards have been around longer then everyone's acting almost 10 years ago they sold a 780 FE. They started pushing them harder over the last 3 gens / 6 years.

Wow this was an incredible explanation thank you very much! I’m so glad you guys here are so patient and welcoming to me with my noob questions!!

The thing is you can now get a 3070 for $400 used. That’ll handle 4k gaming to 99.9% of peoples standards. $1000 used to be the standard price I’d think of a decent computer. now $1000 will get you a solid state storage 4k or vr gaming machine.

now the guys that want to go way overboard can. and those speeds will trickle down each generation. I’ll enjoy buying a 4090 or amd equivalent in a 2 years for $500-700. and that’ll last me another 5 years.

Can't wait to see the performance comparisons of the 4080's and the AMD cards that are $900

Cash for clunkers is what ruined that imo.

I’m over here on a 12 year old nvidia card waiting for that 3070 to hit $200 🤣

I don't understand why suddenly everyone expects third party manufacturers to match Nvidia's prices. As long as Nvidia's been making cards, theirs have been the cheapest... they literally make the silicon.

If everyone expects Gigabyte, Asus, MSI, etc to match Nvidia's prices, you can expect them all to do what EVGA did and drop out because they'll be losing their asses on every high end card they sell.

Fire sale?

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Maybe they are using the samsung foldable screen phone as a benchmark. I have noticed a similar price range for “top of the line”.

MSRP means Maybe Some Random Price

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I'm over here waiting for that sweet sweet hopefully decently priced 7700XT

Lol, Lmao

2nd hand cards suss me out a lot tho.

Sort of like every time a long-time marriage/relationship breaks up.
Always takes a while before one is willing to get back "dating" again.

Y’all be talking like any actual content needing more power has been developed since the 3000 series.

Just get a 3080 ti

Skyrim w/ mods is gonna look the same to you in the dark

They priced the 40 series cards to sell more 30 series card stock. They overproduced because of crypto and don't want to lose money on them.

I got a 12 gig 3080 six months ago, I'm skipping this gen. Haven't even looked at benchmarks or anything, just feels nice to be finally done being on the damn lookout.

Plus my hardline matx build won't fit anything with a PCB larger than the standard height like EVGA xc3's, and... Yeah . RIP

The change in price has never been this high though. Been buying cards since The 9800 pro from ati and Nvidia 6800(doom 3) . Most aib cards maxed out at 10-15% more (330-350 vs 300 at the time) and that was only if they touted better cooling AND overclocked. This is close to a 30% increase.

This is the gen I give AMD another chance. As long as benchmarks test well of course.

Amd is claiming a 1.5x - 1.7x uplift over the 6950. I think you need to check your mathematics here, friend, because you're spreading some questionable information. Let's take the OC'd 4080 and compare it to the 6950.

15,062 ÷ 10644 ~ 1.415. This means the overclocked 4080, which may cost more than the $1200 msrp, is only 41.5% faster than the 6950. If amd isnt bullshitting us, then the overclocked 4080 will be slower than the 7900xtx.

I never heard of path tracing before. Do you have any recommended reading I can do to learn about it?

Bloody hell how bad is the US used car market. Here you can get a running car for very very cheap if you know what you're looking for. I've seen people get functional cars that still have an MOT (Thing that certifies your car is road worthy) for £100 ($140)

Wait for 6 months and buy those below$1000

I built a pc during covid and the shortage and that 4gb RX570 was $400. Now it’s $65. I’ll wait lol

7900xtx ftw, hopefully

An RTX 4090 FE is still $1599, and an RTX FE 4080 is $1199. The performance difference is supposedly between 20-30% which would be a price difference of $317 to $479, seems fair that it's being priced about $400 lower than the 4090 to me :\

And it kind of makes sense that if the performance difference changes because a card is overclocked by a partner vendor, the performance difference is probably less, hence the price difference.

They should be comparing apples to apples, otherwise it's just histrionics.

An OC 4090 will cost similarly more than an FE 4090, the way an OC 4080 will cost more than an FE 4080. So it stands to reason that an OC 4080 will be closer in price & performance to an FE 4090.

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Maybe in USA

I want to see reg market price. Mc are a small company. So pricing is worst for them

Read the article...?

Why buy this when you can run most games out there on ultra with a 300$ 20 series card. Unless you're doing extreme rendering, like heavy CAD work, you don't need these newer cards, might not need them even then.

I like my wires unmelted so I'll stuck with my 3090 ti thanks.

> I welcome anyone to justify buying the Asus ROG Strix 4090 (and likely 4080) versus the others.

##RGB

Time to switch to RDNA3

It'll need a bloody parking spot in your home too

Not so long ago 400$ got you a brand new 1080 GTX.

I would love to buy a 7900XTX in December, but realistically speaking the scalpers are going to make that borderline impossible just like the 4090 has been since launch

Just pick up a 30 series card on black Friday and you'll be fine. The performance per dollar on 40 series is stupid bad. Let the scalpers waste their money. You can easily play any game 144fps at 1440p with 30 series.

Obama did Cash for Clunkers which means all the old cheap junkers got compacted a decade ago.

Just bought a new MacBook. The PC world is out of control. For what you get, Apple is the better bargain...

https://youtu.be/BcLpRaiIoiQ

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I got a new PC with a RTX 3070. I’ll keep that for at least 3 years

upscaling lets you render at much lower resolutions and still maintain most of the quality of rendering native. I am NOT on board with DLSS 3's frame generation BS, though. But the ability for a mid range card to render in "4k" with raytracing is a huge benefit!