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ChunkStumpmon t1_je1f8ji wrote

Reply to comment by CygnusX-1-2112b in How racing drones are used as improvised missiles in Ukraine - They are light, fast and cheap by speckz

Kinda makes you think most of the sacrifices we make to stop terrorism is just security theater

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CygnusX-1-2112b t1_je1hecj wrote

The idea is too simple to pass up, and considering how often it's been showcased to be effective in Ukraine, it's a wonder terror cells haven't been using this method in developed countries.

There must be a reason it's not happening, something we're not privy to that is preventing it from being widespread.

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[deleted] t1_je27w3b wrote

Because terrorists aren’t as common as the government leads you to believe

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poqpoq t1_je5iee9 wrote

This.

Self preservation is a strong basic motivator. It’s extremely rare for an individual to both have enough desire to do something radical with planning while also lacking the will to keep living.

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ChunkStumpmon t1_je1lu42 wrote

It’s nothing- that’s the scary part. Just like philosophy’s mad quest to find out what ensured the scientific laws were obeyed and causation occurred- it’s just happening as it should for now without reason

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[deleted] t1_je21wyk wrote

[deleted]

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ChunkStumpmon t1_je2e2zd wrote

I’m sure they do, they can also stop lone gunman easily- but this is America and there are lots of people stroking guns without actionable intentions. Thank god for Netflix and door dash- our new opiates

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[deleted] t1_je2hw0z wrote

[deleted]

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ChunkStumpmon t1_je2j3pz wrote

I’m Canadian living in Florida- it changes culture. You don’t get in fights or road rage because people could just shoot you in the face. I think once you accept it, it is a way of living. Not without its costs though

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abramthrust t1_je2cccw wrote

FPV pilot (recreational) here.

The reason you don't see more FPV drones used in attacks is that they are quite difficult to fly, and as such skilled enough pilots are relatively hard to come by.

I am fairly certain that the FPV drone attacks we are watching are from people who were pilots before the war and are using the skills they already have.

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CygnusX-1-2112b t1_je2elch wrote

So while this is possible, I'm not quite convinced. Having owned a few cheaper FPV drones, and having a friend who is pretty deep in the hobby, I can say that it's not easy, but it's not a skill any more difficult to learn then good marksmanship, and it's a very innocuous one to learn with purchases that won't raise any red flags. A years time (the time since these drones started being used in combat) is plenty of time to learn how to reliably ram an FPV drone in roughly the area you want.

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Lint_baby_uvulla t1_je2vzr3 wrote

future

got it, AI autonomous murder bots will target FPV pilots in the first waves.

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slowslownotbad t1_je52bvl wrote

Now I really want to try an FPV drone. Former military pilot, I still think I’m hot shit, haven’t thought about aircraft in ages.

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abramthrust t1_je5ar04 wrote

They fly less like an aircraft and more like the most manuverable helicopter you've ever imagined.

Doubly so for the ones capable of 3D flight model (props can spin backward)

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[deleted] t1_je83h25 wrote

They’re fun as hell bro buy a controller and velocidrone on the computer and practice a bit then buy one!!

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IronicBread t1_je46rwh wrote

Nah that's not it, doesn't take long to learn and you can train using simulators. Learning to fly them isn't a big barrier to entry.

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mike772772 t1_je38lz0 wrote

Ahahaha you ain’t lying I got mine 2 months ago and can barely go half throttle lol scary fast and so much fun

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870223 t1_je53rsm wrote

So you're saying 9/11 was done by folks who were willing to go to flight school but FPV is too hard?

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abramthrust t1_je5acx2 wrote

TBH, yes.

They both take about the same pilot training (hrs wise) but FPV is far less destructive (and headline grabbing) than hijacking a plane full of people.

As a bonus*, the plane is already a bomb with all the fuel onboard. FPV terrorist has to make his own warhead.

*"bonus" is a highly subjective word here.

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870223 t1_je5eh4w wrote

Fair.

But can kerosine melt steel beams?

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abramthrust t1_je5fmab wrote

>But can kerosine melt steel beams?

Assuming you're not just memeing:

Not a mettalurgist, but IIRC it's can't fully melt structural steel, but it can weaken it until it no longer has the excess load bearing capacity to remain stable.

If Memeing: no one has conclusively proven that LiPo battery fires didn't cause the world trade center collapse...

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[deleted] t1_je83e28 wrote

Dude it took me like a week of playing with the simulator to be able to fly well enough to do something like that, it doesn’t really take any skill to fly a drone straight to a target

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apocolipse t1_je3vuu7 wrote

Logistically speaking, the size/weight of improvised explosives that deliver results terrorists are looking for are typically too heavy for small drones. Terror devices also typically employ various amounts of miscellaneous shrapnel, to get the most effect out of limited explosive power, but also significantly increasing payload weight. To make any use out of explosives that weigh enough to let the drone still be pretty fast, you'd have to swarm them. That'd be a pretty effective tactic, but it obviates the benefit of drones over just using any other long range weaponry, precision guidance. If you're just going to spray and pray, do it with something bigger. For super precision individual strikes, a racing drone could maybe take out small targets, 1-3 people, but that's not a terrorists target. And even worse for those cases, they're extremely loud and easy to spot, they wouldn't be too difficult to evade. They're fast and nimble but that's relative, you're looking at 60mph averages, especially with a payload. You can dodge a 60mph car, you can probably dodge a 60mph drone.
They're honestly most effective in Ukraine because Russia is just terribly incompetent. For military use they're effective at rendering stationary equipment inoperable, or taking out a lead truck in a convoy, or blowing up an ammo depot. They're easily deflected with proper equipment since we know what tech they're using (2.4ghz or 900/433mhz control links, 5.8ghz video links), Jamming them is actually easy, just Russia sucks and can't wipe its ass and shit on its elbow at the same time. If they had enough explosive capability to, say, blow up a bridge, you can bet the Kerch Straight bridge would be gone by now.

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Delbert3US t1_je1wh0h wrote

I think it is that currently they have to be individually controlled and are somewhat short ranged. That control signal can be tracked and intercepted.
Once they can be more autonomous, then the flood gates open.

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StatusSea5409 t1_je1yiuh wrote

All you'd really have to do is get close to the maximum range and go in. It might get intercepted but for now there's no real protection for it

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Delbert3US t1_je2kv4i wrote

I was talking more about signal tracking to the source. The farther away the longer you have to track the signal to its source.

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OcotilloWells t1_je3eqyk wrote

Even worse, I was just reading (I think on Hackaday) that at least some DJI drones transmit both its location and the controller's location coordinates unencrypted.

The thing is, you take that into consideration and there's ways you can mitigate the risk in that. Also, how quickly can the Russian figure that signal out, convert the drone coordinates into whatever they use, and pass that to a gun or missle battalion fire direction center? As well as how quickly that FDC can get that to a gun/missle section that can engage that coordinates? I'm sure the Ukrainians can say, with fair accuracy by now.

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StatusSea5409 t1_je2lugv wrote

Oh. Well that's easy. Grab a few burgers, find stray dogs, let them get a good smell and start begging, that's when you fly the drone do the damage, connect the controller to a stray, toss the bag of burgers and walk off. As long as you have your crime skill high enough you should be able to pull it off without a nat20

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Sharp-Accident-2061 t1_je4v9vx wrote

I imagine it’s very difficult to make an explosive charge small and deadly enough to fit on a drone.

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CygnusX-1-2112b t1_je4wmn1 wrote

Tell me, did you read the article at all, and have you watched anything to come out of Ukraine in the past year? It is in fact not so difficult as it may seem.

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Sharp-Accident-2061 t1_je4y2vq wrote

I did not read the article as it requires me to make an account. Still producing explosives is not an easy task. In the US you can but smokeless powder for reloading and such. But that won’t make a bomb without a sufficiently robust device to contain it. Don’t know what that process is like in other countries.

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Draymond_Purple t1_je54hs0 wrote

A drone bomb is still a bomb, so controlling bomb making materials still prevents drone bombs too

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skyfireee t1_je409dg wrote

Its not THAT effective in warzone, thats why you do not hear much about famous turkish UAV's anymore. It is very easy to distress any signals in area using low qualified soldier (driver + operator) and RLB-vehicle. When we see a drone putting a grenade (whatever side of conflict it is), ok, great, you wounded 2 soldiers in trench. What about other 12.998 that nearby?

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CygnusX-1-2112b t1_je4ne39 wrote

Because it's not about its tactical effectiveness, but its strategic effectiveness. You kill those two in a place where they were supposed to be safe, at a time when there was no event near, and most of those other 12,998 are going to always feel in the back of their minds like they could be next, no matter where they are. It shows paranoia, and damages event morale.

But even more, I'm talking about the targeting of civilians for terror purposes. The effect of fear based on the killing of a few is amplified greatly because it's done in a place they're definitely supposed to be safe.

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skyfireee t1_je62ny2 wrote

Thanks, I added another phobia XD And now Iam jealous for some "high life" and government buildings which surrounded with no-gps zone (drones (which relies) just drops down there)

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