Racial diversity in top tech & biotech companies [OC]Submitted by teamongered t3_10iowxk in dataisbeautiful
vol99_ t1_j5g3880 wrote
I guarantee that the vast majority of the non-white and non-Asian employees in these companies are confined to non-technical jobs like the hr department or something. These companies would love to hire a lot more black people for pr purposes, but just can’t find the candidates to do so.
Garconcl t1_j5gceeh wrote
This, I work for a Fin-tech company, all women are relegated to non-technical jobs and all men to technical jobs, and it's extremely funny seeing them appear as a well balanced company yet they discriminate men for non-technical positions and women for technical ones and some of the women they turned down are 30x times better than around 50% of my current coworkers, lol.
TheHolyPuck t1_j5jcoed wrote
So in your opinion the women interviewed were 30x better than 50% of your current workers, and were all turned down cause they were women? Yeah… I call bullshit
Garconcl t1_j5k01fu wrote
>some of the women they turned down are 30x times better than around 50% of my current coworkers
Learn to read: "some of the women they turned down are 30x times better than around 50% of my current coworkers" I never said all.
I know 3 of the women that applied for positions equal or below to mine, I worked or studied with them, all extremely skilled. They ended up hiring guys with a lot less verified experience, hell one of them was so infamous that he said he had 15 years of experience from asia, he didn't know the basics, his work had to be peer reviewed for every single detail almost to the point of being re done again.
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My theory is that they don't want to hire women because dealing with the lack of basic manners some of those guys have.
amazingmollusque t1_j5hfxfg wrote
Ugh, such a great example of how sexism hurts both men and women.
rewt127 t1_j5jprv7 wrote
The guy is just straight up lying. No modern US tech company in California would turn away someone who is a significantly better fit for a position just because they are a woman.
camxus t1_j5ixxm4 wrote
stupid comment. this called people in their natural role. and it works. this ofc doesn’t mean women shouldn’t be ALLOWED to take up those positions if they are good and vice versa. stop crying wolf and focus on more important things
slutshaa t1_j5iyxun wrote
in their natural role? what 😭
camxus t1_j5izd3h wrote
omg. in the role that best suits their abilities … u lot read into shit too much.
slutshaa t1_j5izg5a wrote
but that generalization isn't true? men aren't more suited to engineering roles than women are
5irSkellington t1_j5j0ltj wrote
All evidence points to the fact that is in fact the case though. Not something we have to be happy about , but it's the truth
FrogOfDreams t1_j5jbeq7 wrote
No, the evidence is that men are ON AVERAGE more likely to be better in tech. And as long as your hiring process isn't bogus, a woman with the same qualifications is just as good as a man because she hot THE SAME QUALIFICATIONS
5irSkellington t1_j5jlx4j wrote
I agree though, the problem is usually interest and not capability
camxus t1_j5j4nhs wrote
sorry. u can’t blame my EE class having 6:300 f/m ratio on the patriarchy. It’s highkey an insult to the females who actually end up going thru it. It has less to do with gender and more with sex. The girls who were in my class were verrrry obviously different to say female artist friends of mine. Their brains just work differently.
it just doesn’t work that way. Females and Males generally have different abilities and aptitudes and that’s fine. Women need to stop trying to be men and tap into the skills that make them special. Same goes for men
DevinCauley-Towns t1_j5j8fyr wrote
Most evidence actually suggests that girls choose to go into certain STEM roles at lower rates than men for a variety of reasons, most of which are NOT inherently biological and the “biological” reasons don’t present until much later in life after the other factors could already skew the results. Here are some excerpts from a meta analysis conducted on the topic.
> Successful careers in math and science require many types of cognitive abilities. Females tend to excel in verbal abilities, with large differences between females and males found when assessments include writing samples. High-level achievement in science and math requires the ability to communicate effectively and comprehend abstract ideas, so the female advantage in writing should be helpful in all academic domains. Males outperform females on most measures of visuospatial abilities, which have been implicated as contributing to sex differences on standardized exams in mathematics and science.
There are differences in performance between men and women for certain areas, though being a good SWE or other technical role requires a variety of skills, men generally perform better at one type and women generally perform better another. Anecdotally, as someone working in tech I find my female co-workers to be more organized and have better communication skills that make them easier to work with and often perform quality work more consistently.
> A wide range of sociocultural forces contribute to sex differences in mathematics and science achievement and ability—including the effects of family, neighborhood, peer, and school influences; training and experience; and cultural practices. We conclude that early experience, biological factors, educational policy, and cultural context affect the number of women and men who pursue advanced study in science and math and that these effects add and interact in complex ways. There are no single or simple answers to the complex questions about sex differences in science and mathematics.
If you read the above, 3 of the 4 categories contributing to the differences in STEM achievement are unrelated to biology. Meaning these differences are NOT generally “natural” as you incorrectly suggested. Early experience, such as being told you don’t have the ability to pursue STEM due to your “natural abilities” is one such influence that reduces performance and drives women away from the field. So literally the behaviour you’re exhibiting is a contributing factor to why your program has so many men and few women. Next time, stop being an ass and do some research before parroting harmful sexist ideas that are clearly NOT supported by the literature, or at very least don’t make up the majority of differences.
camxus t1_j5jct56 wrote
i appreciate u doing research and i agree. u literally repeated my point. “NATURALLY” has nothing to do with biological in my prev context. i repeatedly already said natural abilities in context to what skills people have tendencies for be it biological, cultural, societal doesnt matter.
for lost engineering positions while communication is a part of the job it isn’t the most important part. female PMs are better than males for instance. There is space for women leads in tech. My point is that a majority of women wouldn’t do well in the Engineering department due to reasons you highlighted above
camxus t1_j5jd8ts wrote
i appreciate u doing research and i agree. u literally repeated my point. “NATURALLY” has nothing to do with biological in my prev context. i repeatedly already said natural abilities in context to what skills people have tendencies for be it biological, cultural, societal doesnt matter.
for most engineering positions while communication is a part of the job it isn’t the most important part. female PMs are better than males for instance. There is space for women leads in tech. My point is that a majority of women wouldn’t do well in the Engineering department due to reasons you highlighted above
also i’m not sexist. you just don’t see the value women’s roles hold in society. If women don’t do them and men can’t society would fall apart. best luck to you
camxus t1_j5jegtd wrote
also i think you should read a bit more of that meta analysis especially on:
Sex and Gender
Biological and Innate
Abilities and Achievement
> Humans are born with innate abilities, such as the ability to learn a language, but the language they learn, if any, depends largely on their experience. Similarly, they are born with the innate ability to count and discern quantities, but how they develop those abilities depends on their environment and learning experiences. Abilities are developed in supportive environments.
ALSO science and engineering are very different fields. The relationship between male and female scientists is way more balanced than that of m:f engineers. You’re trying to make the woke point that women and men have exactly the same aptitudes and this is simply false. OFC there are women who have aptitudes usually found in males but that’s not the usual case. There’s so many biological and societal factors that makes us different from another.
camxus t1_j5j4use wrote
I’d much rather have a female accountant, bookkeeper or HR recruiter/manager than a male. They just do the job better. The best know their worth and get paid accordingly.
AdRepresentative5085 t1_j5j0fow wrote
Non-tech can be anything that's not very physical. The only jobs where these discrepancies realistically exist are firefighting, construction, mining and oil rigs.
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What is a "natural role's" requirements in a tech company besides having a brain and mouth? Imposing weird limits like yours sets your company to be in a tough position where you have no one to assume leadership in vacant roles, even if just temporary.
camxus t1_j5j5d19 wrote
well for one women will fit well better in interpersonal roles such as HR and (low-mid level) teaching (if the pay was better tho).
Women are generally better organized than men which if they are decent with numbers lends them well with managerial roles and accounting. Women have different physical abilities too which gives them advantages in sports and modeling.
Societally Women have advantages in Media Creation Online and in legacy media. Marketing
everyone of these is a natural role
it’s not about setting limits for people. if they have the required skills they should get the job. just the fact is that majority of women dont
AdRepresentative5085 t1_j5kncvo wrote
By what measurement are they fit for the role other than an interview? When you choose a candidate based on numbers charts it misses the entire point of statistics, which is observational data. It doesn’t aim to prove but to disprove, in this case any person is viable. You said it yourself, it’s not about their sex.
camxus t1_j5l86of wrote
when did i ever say one should choose them based on the differences in sex? i’m saying these differences exist generally. i believe every candidate for a job is unique case.
obviously a woman who has been able to get the necessary requirements to be competitive on the job market should get the same chances to get the job her male counterparts do.
AdRepresentative5085 t1_j5r9wgk wrote
>all women are relegated to non-technical jobs and all men to technical jobs...yet they discriminate men for non-technical positions and women for technical ones and some of the women they turned down are 30x times better
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>great example of how sexism hurts both men and women
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>stupid comment. this called people in their natural role. and it works.
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>when did i ever say one should choose them based on the differences in sex?
Okay. Sure thing. The large discrepancy between both sex groups and their roles has a normal standard deviation, not out of bounds at all, nope.
BubblyForce8229 t1_j5ioyst wrote
>and non-Asian employees in these companies are confined to non-technical jobs like the hr department or something
note that the most diverse company (Amazon) has a large warehouse operation.
orswich t1_j5itbtv wrote
Thos is my thought also.. if counting ALL employees, then the vast majority of amazon workers in some areas amazon warehouses would probably be Latino or black, while Asians and whites dominate the office jobs
FightOnForUsc t1_j5hcvt9 wrote
I work at one of the listed companies, as a software engineer, just out of college. Three of us in my area of the company were hired just out of college, 1 white, 1 Asian American, 1 African American
cgyguy81 t1_j5ij01f wrote
I have a feeling that's the case for Amazon.
No-Weekend6347 t1_j5itzzv wrote
Do the black graduates not exist?
I am assuming you are speaking more CS and Engineering fields.
enevetable t1_j5hygsa wrote
Pure BS
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