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omdano t1_ix4hqwi wrote

This is just migrant death? from all causes?

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Followup: Let's say we have 2000 deaths annually per 2 million migrants (1 per 1000), what makes this worse than USA's 9 per 1000 death rate [1]?

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[1]: https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/fastats/deaths.htm

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Please tell me I am wrong, this is so dogshit on western governments and critics if it's right, please tell me I am wrong.

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putrasherni t1_ix5lkfw wrote

What I find hypocritical, is the abject poverty Indians in India live in. Tens of millions of people living with their families in uninhabitable slums all across India make them vulnerable to find anything even the slightest better chance of better cafes, so that their kids may have some future if they survive.

This is the reality of poverty in India, making gulf a better place to work. Arabs know this and so does the Indian government, and Indians in gulf bring back billions in foreign exchange reserves back to India usually helping their families to have a fridge and some education. UK is where it is today because of all the loot they did in India, India’s gdp was 23% of worlds economy in 1700 and was a mere 0.3% in 1947 when the Brits left India.

Also this chart is all lies, yes there have been deaths, this is all deaths of foreign nationals, but it’s WC Qatar drenched in blood.

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tronaldmcdump t1_ix5r67e wrote

Total Deaths from Covid in Qatar as of today: 684.

Yep, looks like it's still Qatar's fault.

Edit: and you completely changed your post. Originally they were blaming this on Covid.

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omdano t1_ix6wx1b wrote

doesn't really, look at the stats mentioned in the original comment I posted.

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Adeposta t1_ix7ealv wrote

There's a lot going on which is difficult to get on one graph. Rather than migrant death any cause there is probably a more telling measure. It might be construction worker deaths without preexisting conditions per hours worked Vs comparable hot nations and Vs previous stadium building projects

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ligasecatalyst t1_ix8czdi wrote

The annual USA mortality statistic you quoted is across all age groups, including seniors. The labour migrants in Qatar are young, able-bodied men. The annual mortality for males in the 25-34 age group in the US is less than 0.2 per thousand per year. Qatar has a more than fivefold excess deaths for migrants compared to the similar age group in the USA, which leads to a very rough estimate that around 80% of migrant deaths are excess deaths compared to a similar demographic cohort in the U.S.

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jmr1190 t1_ix5rdgg wrote

Focussing on deaths allows apologists to say ‘throw this out, it refers to ALL deaths’. And neatly sidesteps the fact that most of the entire country over the last 20 years has been built out of slave labour, under horrendous working conditions.

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omdano t1_ix60t5p wrote

Can you answer the follow up i edited into the comment? I don't want the answers to be repetitive, so if you're against death apologists, can you provide me with your side?

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jmr1190 t1_ix62t4r wrote

My point is more that arguing a contested statistic is a bad framing device. I think arguing specifically over migrant deaths is a red herring - and it allows those who are trying to dismiss the issue an easy way to disregard the entire discussion.

There is plenty of evidence that migrants are being convinced to pay a lot of money through phoney ‘recruitment agencies’, often emptying their life savings into such schemes to earn as little as $0.50 per hour in excruciating conditions.

Human Rights Watch are literally having to remind the Qatari government that their labour force actually do need to be paid at all. There are accounts of workers being deported without pay. These are based on accounts and obviously won’t be accounted for in any official data.

Added to which, I find the argument ‘these workers have conditions just as bad in [insert developing nation] to be unsatisfactory. These developing nations don’t have the resources for 10 billion dollar vanity projects - and if they did, obviously they should be treating workers well, too. Working standards shouldn’t be a race to the very lowest standards in the world.

EDIT: Finding the downvotes amusing. There’s not a lot that’s controversial here than pointing out facts. Workers ARE being paid as little as $0.50 an hour. Qatar CAN afford to pay them more. There HAVE been difficulties with workers being paid at all. These are all facts. If you want to argue the point on working conditions in other countries, then…I guess you must really like capitalism.

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omdano t1_ix63ai6 wrote

The workers are earning much more than they would do in any other place AFAIK (I used to be a migrant in UAE), I do agree that the system of wakeel needs to be removed.

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By the way, the USA isn't a developing nation.

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Anyways, thank you for your lengthy reply, I will review it a couple more times.

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jmr1190 t1_ix7kdh5 wrote

They’re earning up to $0.50 an hour. I’m not here to defend anyone doing that, and nor should anyone. The USA also has some horrendous working conditions, I’m not defending this either (although, nowhere is it legally this bad).

There is obviously a lot of money in Qatar - it shouldn’t be morally acceptable to find the population with the lowest wage expectancy in the world and exploit that.

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