RI Assistance with Landlord Issues

Submitted by gamefreak9199 t3_11g304h in RhodeIsland

My wife and I recently moved into a new apartment, and we've had nothing but issues since we moved in.

We've had heat maybe 4 weeks of the 3 months we've lived here. We've been without heat for over 2 weeks at this point, our apartment never gets warmer than 58f even with space heaters running. The space heaters are also much more expensive to run than our gas heating. They disconnected our boiler without making us aware, and only told us when we asked why we haven't had heat. Our landlord said it'll be at least another few weeks before they service the boiler.

In addition, our tub does not drain at all. We have to bail it with a bucket after every shower. The water sitting leaves the tub filthy every time and it's impossible to keep it clean. We noticed this issue 2 days before we moved in, and they said it would be fixed within a week. Every time we mention it they say they'll have someone come in soon, that it's a lead pipe and they were aware of the issue prior to us moving in (no they did not tell us).

Rent was due yesterday, and I have not paid it as neither of our landlords will respond to my texts inquiring about an actual date these issues will be resolved. I have read that you can deduct from your rent due to loss of services when you are without utilities, but I don't understand the specifics of how to go about that, and I don't want to be evicted.

If anyone has any advice on how to navigate a situation like this, or if there are any agencies we can reach out to for assistance, it would be a great help. Thank you in advance.

Edit: Thank you all for your advice. I've added both landlords to a group text and outlined the sections of the RI Tenant Landlord handbook that they are not in compliance with, as well as the state building, and housing maintenance and occupancy codes that they are violating. I listed our options for moving forward as outlined under Section D of 'Noncompliance by Landlord' and asked them to let us know how they wish to proceed. I also requested the exact date(s) we will have our heat restored and our drain fixed. In addition, I explained that I'd like this addressed before I send our rent payment in the event that they choose a rent deduction option. I will update this post again when there is resolution or a development.

If anybody has a 2 or 3bed rental available in the Warwick/West Warwick area please feel free to reach out!

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Hawks47 t1_jamefcq wrote

The best way to go would be to open an escrow account with the courts and pay rent there. That way, you can’t be evicted for non-payment. I know there is more to it but I had a friend who did it this way as she was advised by an attorney. Any withheld funds from rent normally goes through a legal process.

Hope this helps!

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Brodyftw00 t1_jamirmk wrote

This is the way. It shows you ate withholding rent for repair issues, not because you don't want to pay.

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gamefreak9199 OP t1_jamim2i wrote

I will look into this, thank you very much for the suggestion.

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Low-Dragonfly-5352 t1_janbyok wrote

It’s called rent abatement and you fall within the rights to withhold rent or pay to have those things addressed and take it out of the rent. Be prepared though, I’ve been in court for 5 years with old landlords with no end in sight. Wish you the best of luck

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Sleuthiestofsleuths t1_jamgpw2 wrote

Contact state senator Tiara Mack. Not sure where you are, but she's district 6. She's speaking on Tenant rights legislation at the state house today, March 2nd. I just read about it, so she appears to be actively addressing the nonsense that you, and many others, are dealing with. She, or her office, may be able to suggest next steps. Good luck!

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SelectStarFromNames t1_jaqhg4q wrote

Thanks for posting this, I didn't know about this bill and now I've emailed my state rep and senator to let them know I support it!

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gamefreak9199 OP t1_jaraoxb wrote

I sent her a long email, thank you for the suggestion!

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Sleuthiestofsleuths t1_jarc0r0 wrote

I hope she can help! Funny that I had JUST read about her efforts for tenant rights before I read your post. Sometimes, the universe is paying attention :)

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gamefreak9199 OP t1_jarferh wrote

I hope so too! At the very least I made sure to communicate my appreciation for her hard work. Thank you again for your recommendation. :)

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TheGratitudeBot t1_jargi9j wrote

Hey there gamefreak9199 - thanks for saying thanks! TheGratitudeBot has been reading millions of comments in the past few weeks, and you’ve just made the list!

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canibringmydog t1_jami7dd wrote

This is becoming so common here. There are protections where heat is required, but as you’re experiencing, good luck enforcing it. I’d look into the escrow account as another commenter suggested, but if I were you I would start looking for a new place to rent and break your lease. If the landlord is like this, imagine the rent increase they will try to throw at you come renewal when they actually have had to make repairs. (They can raise it to any price for any reason come release renewal. And boy do they).

Best of luck. We have been writing to state reps trying to get some movement for more tenant protections. There was also a tenant protest on Tuesday by the state house. We really need to start getting loud. We can afford $1700 rent - imagine the people who can’t and are facing these landlords. It’s disgusting.

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gamefreak9199 OP t1_jamiwdf wrote

I'd love to look for a new place to rent, it's just difficult as we have no references as this is our first time renting. Most of our savings have gone into this apartment and furnishings, so trying to get together moving funds again will take some time. We are also on a month to month lease which gives me a lot of anxiety about rent increases/eviction as retaliation.

I feel terrible for those who are dealing with even worse slumlords in the more affordable housing :(

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canibringmydog t1_jamnvq8 wrote

Oh god I feel you. I’m sorry this is your first experience renting.

Document everything. Retaliation is still illegal, though you may have trouble proving it’s retaliation and not “market increases” 🤮

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gamefreak9199 OP t1_jamqnv4 wrote

I've been photographing the thermostat every day for the past few days just to have evidence. Thankfully 99% of the communication with the landlords is through text so I have written proof of all of these issues and their response time/lack of response. I just don't even know what to do with it all. Do I just save it in case this goes to court?

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canibringmydog t1_jamxvvq wrote

Yep. I have been through small claims with a landlord before (because of course I have lol). The more documentation the better. 10/10 do recommend. I didn’t have an attorney, just my emails, messages, photos. This was for a landlord who kept 3k in deposits to renovate the place when we moved out to prepare it for sale lol we got some back, but not everything. Filing fees were minimal. Might not be a bad idea to start that process, actually. Would be even more apparent if the landlord tried to do anything retaliatory after that.

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gamefreak9199 OP t1_jar83zh wrote

I've been documenting as much as possible and I'm considering trying to write out a full timeline of events where we were without heat, water, hot water, etc just to have it for reference. Everybody I've talked to has basically told me to move out as fast as possible, so I think we'll be going that route as soon as we can afford to.

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canibringmydog t1_jarar2i wrote

It feels like a big defeat to have to move back in with family or crash with friends but if that’s an option, take it. There is no shame in that game anymore. It’s all survival now.

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4k5 t1_jamhkuh wrote

Google the rhode island landlord tenant handbook and give it a read to learn your rights. I'm a LL and yours sounds like a deadbeat. I use the handbook for basic guidance on what can and can't legally be done.

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gamefreak9199 OP t1_jamijr2 wrote

I just finished reading through it and I saw this part: https://imgur.com/64VOflj

How do we actually go about pursuing option 1 or 3? Do you have any experience with the process? Thank you.

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4k5 t1_jamjerm wrote

I would have a calm conversation with your landlord about your plan to pursue option 1 or 3. Hopefully that will light a fire under their ass. If you need to actually pursue one of those options, be prepared to take them to court to actually get the costs back. I would think it would be a slam dunk as long as you keep records of costs and the fact that the heat is still out. But really read the specific law and understand what it says.

Be the adult, your landlord may get irrationally mad but legally cannot retaliate if you are doing something within the law. They might also not renew your lease when it expires.

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gamefreak9199 OP t1_jamqss5 wrote

Thank you very much for the advice, I will do my best to get in touch with them. They have been ignoring our messages recently so I am unsure how best to reach them. Unfortunately our lease is month-to-month so if they choose not to renew it gives us a very small window to find housing.

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4k5 t1_jamtjx2 wrote

Dude if that is the case cut tie and find a new place to live. Just separate yourself from someone like that. It sucks that some shifty LL get away with doing this, but actually holding them accountable is a headache because you have to bring them to court if they refuse to pay.

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Live_Froyo3636 t1_jamkyto wrote

Im so sorry you are going through this. I’ve gad several of these issues recently and although resolved now, I had to do some research as to what my rights were as tenant. Heat and hot water fall into same category. You must have at all times. If not fixed within 48 hrs, landlord must tell you when it will be fixed. As a tenant, you are entitled to be paid in compensation equal to what you pay in rent ($1675/month divided by 30/31 days in a month to get what you pay ‘daily’ ) for every day you have been with out hot water and heat. You need a lawyer to get this though. But the landlord in turn must pay your lawyer fees. In order for this to happen, you must not make another ‘deal’ or agreement with your landlord if you want this full compensation for what you’ve had to endure during this time. And since its gone on for almost the entire time you’ve been living there I think you should contact a lawyer. In my case, I made a deal with my landlord and had some money knocked off my rent for a couple months going forward, and for me that was more than reasonable compensation even though I went without heat for weeks in December and no hot water for 2 weeks in January. But Ive been in my apartment for 6 years, and most issues have been resolved in a timely manner. I hope this helps some.

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gamefreak9199 OP t1_jamr7un wrote

Thank you very much for all of the info, it helps a lot. We have also been without hot water/running water several times since we moved in. Is there a specific type of lawyer I should contact? I worry about legal fees outweighing what we could withhold from our rent. Thank you.

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barsoapguy t1_jamo3ef wrote

Make sure to document that things aren’t working and the temperature inside the apartment!

If you end up in court you’ll need all the proof you can get.

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jfg1984 t1_jamg9cs wrote

I own a couple of rentals - sounds like an absentee landlord. If you want to, DM me and I’ll give you some guidance. I’m mostly wondering why the heat hasn’t been repaired, did they tell you anything? Sometimes getting contractors can be tough and a heating system replacement can take a week or two to be completed (depending on how busy the contractor is/availability of material) but that kind of delay is extreme

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gamefreak9199 OP t1_jamh7nx wrote

I will send you a DM, thank you.

For anyone else reading: 9 pipes burst over a month ago on the other side of the building due to no heat. They cut and capped them as nobody is living on that side of the building. Their explanation is they have now disconnected the boilers until they figure out what to do about those pipes, and that they will have a company come in a few weeks to "flush it out".

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Woahmikeison t1_japvwz1 wrote

They literally just have to thread the pipes and put a cap on them, not complicated at all

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gamefreak9199 OP t1_jar86ps wrote

Well what I don't understand is that I spoke with the maintenance guy the night that the pipes burst and he said he did exactly that. I don't get why they now need to disconnect boilers to resolve that issue.

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brick1972 t1_jap3cxk wrote

There's a lot of other good advice but you should definitely look at a new situation because this is the behavior of people who already don't have money to maintain their.property and/or are taunting you to do something about it.

Either way you do not want to rent from them.

I don't want to dox myself with specifics but I have had tenants themselves cause heat issues and even on holidays you can find people because to do repairs because money talks. Your landlords are either cheap or stupid or both and may also be seriously malicious or at least uncaring.

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gamefreak9199 OP t1_jar8eca wrote

I believe you are completely correct. Every time they've come out to service something small all they talk about is how much money they've put into this building, etc, etc.

The tub issue I referenced in my original post was supposed to be resolved by December 18th and is still continually being pushed back, which to me clearly shows they haven't even tried to schedule a repair.

We will be trying to move as soon as we can afford it.

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dilly-dilly- t1_japghcx wrote

This is clearly laid out in the landlord tenant handbook.

https://www.courts.ri.gov/Courts/districtcourt/PDF/Handbook.pdf

Section 5.D basically describes your situation exactly and what you should do.

I'd send them a letter telling them the heating situation and tell them you want to deduct the extra energy costs from the rent. Even state you'll need to purchase a new unit as you need more rooms heated. Show your utilities increase, document everything. If everything is reasonable, how is your landlord supposed to hold up in court why he didn't fix your heating in the winter?

I'm paranoid as a landlord, I fix everything same week if not same day. I always give a copy of the employee handbook as many don't even realize they have a lot of power. It's supposed to be a favorable agreement between two parties and we both have a responsibility to each other.

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gamefreak9199 OP t1_jar8kpn wrote

Thank you for being a good landlord and maintaining your properties, your tenants are lucky people! I wrote a long message to both of them this morning detailing the building codes they were violating and outlining the sections of the Landlord Tenant handbook they are out of compliance with. Hopefully they will work to resolve the issues and we can work to find a new place in the meantime.

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dilly-dilly- t1_jas65xn wrote

I hope it works out for you and they do what is right. Update if you can! This always intrigues me because if you read the handbook, the tenants have a lot of rights. It confuses me that people describe complete unlivable situations but act like there is nothing to do. How would I convince a judge that it's reasonable for me to leave my tenants without heat in the winter?

I see it as, if I was paying to live in on a property and neglect was costing me additional out of pocket cost, I should document it and discuss rebating these costs with the landlord. If they give me any shit or ignore me, right to small claims court. I haven't needed to go for this situation but I'd love to see how this wouldn't go in favor of the tenant. (Maybe the court system is corrupt)

The main issue you can see in the handbook is that if a landlord violates these rights, tenant basically is able to leave. There are clearly costs to moving. Landlords should be responsible in those cases where they couldn't hold up their end of the deal and provide livable housing. There should be time limits on when critical amenities are expected to be fixed so tenants aren't left hanging. This is what I think most of those tenant rallies should be focusing on if they aren't. They highlight questionable things like past eviction shielding and no application costs.

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Woahmikeison t1_japvlxc wrote

RI tenant landlord handbook is your friend

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Efficient_Bird_406 t1_japzczn wrote

I’m in the same boat with the shower plumbing. And I have been, for years (the issue gets resolved but not fully, the drain has never been 100% and gets mostly fixed and then worse over time).

Anyways, I don’t have any recs because I’m so nervous getting on my landlord’s bad side that I don’t bring in outside forces to deal with their incompetence. They’re kind of an asshole. But I’ll be keeping my eyes on this thread and reading the handbook. And I totally feel your pain, maybe we’ll find a solution lol. So…solidarity!

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gamefreak9199 OP t1_jar7xi8 wrote

That's exactly how I'm feeling as far as not getting on their bad side, but if they're willing to leave us without heat for up to 6 weeks, I don't really think they have a good side lol. The only thing that helps our drain is liquid plumber and it'll slowly drain for maybe a day or two tops. I messaged them today in a group text explaining all of the housing codes they're violating and outlining the relevant parts of the Landlord Tenant handbook, so we will see.

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Efficient_Bird_406 t1_jasgxth wrote

Good- I hope they resolve it for you and at least you have proof of bringing the issues up. I've had my fair share of heating issues too, but 6 weeks is egregious, especially when we had that really cold streak last month.

I wish I knew the name, but they've used an industrial strength drain cleaner and that worked the best. But you'll still catch me with a bucket now and again lol. Best of luck!

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allredjam t1_jamq9mv wrote

Is this Michie Realty?? Sounds a lot like what I went thru… awful, neglect people

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gamefreak9199 OP t1_jamrbqc wrote

It is not Michie Realty, it is a small LLC based out of Coventry. I believe they own 2 other properties as well.

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Mourningwood05 t1_jan7i29 wrote

If you are not familiar with the "Landlord tenet handbook" it's free online and outline your rights and options in some cases.

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Blackbird8919 t1_jao1xsn wrote

Sounds like my old landlord in Bristol. Completely slumord. Sorry to hear this is happening to you.

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almorey t1_jaoflsn wrote

Sounds like you moved into my old unit. For your sake I hope not

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deathsythe t1_japi6j8 wrote

RIGL 23-27.3 & RIGL 45-24.3 are what you're looking for for building code and occupancy code respectively.

>It is also the landlord's responsibility to make sure all electrical, plumbing, sanitary, heating, and other facilities (and appliances provided as part of the rental agreement) are kept in operable condition and meet housing code standards.

and

>He or she is also obligated to provide hot and cold running water at all times and must provide heat (68 degrees minimum but it may be higher under some local ordinances) between October 1st and May 1st, except when heat or hot water are generated by an installation controlled solely by the tenant and supplied directly by a public utility connection.

RI Landlord-Tenant Handbook(PDF) is your friend, and should be your LL's too. Seems like they're one of the ones that give the rest of us a bad name.

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gamefreak9199 OP t1_jar8mq4 wrote

Thank you, I outlined both of these examples when I messaged them both this morning. I appreciate your help!

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huh_phd t1_jamf8qx wrote

Where is said apartment?

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gamefreak9199 OP t1_jamgu85 wrote

West Warwick. Our rent is $1675 a month.

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MediaGuy2020 t1_jamqft4 wrote

I am closing soon on a multi and should have a two bedroom available for $1500 + utilities in Warwick/WW line. I would be living there as well. Closing April 1 if you’re interested.

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Mountain_Bill5743 t1_jaooost wrote

Just wanted to say stuff like this makes me happy to see. Thanks for being reasonable on costs and reaching out to OP. This is the type of community that sadly feels like its disappearing as more conglomerates buy up the state.

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gamefreak9199 OP t1_jamqzva wrote

I would definitely be interested in this, thank you very much for the offer! Should I dm you?

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huh_phd t1_jamhmy2 wrote

Jesus christ. My the mortgage on my multifamily home isn't much more than that

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gamefreak9199 OP t1_jamiafe wrote

I know :/ It's insanely expensive for how bare bones it is. One of our rooms reeks of cigarettes no matter how much we deep clean the carpet and walls. None of our blinds have strings, we have windows without screens, very drafty, etc.

It's our first time renting so we did not have previous references, this place seemed nice when we were viewing it but they hid a lot from us. Our bathtub had been painted white to hide how bad the finish was, though they thankfully finally had it reglazed last month.

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Delicious_Grape1313 t1_jauq8rw wrote

Definitely look into Royal Mills in West Warwick. Great place, community feel, and they “consider” unique backgrounds, like little rental history but good credit and a good BCI.

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