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PatAss98 t1_ixwvltt wrote

Reply to comment by Advanced-Guard-4468 in 27 Pennridge teachers deride planned cut to Social Studies requirement by HanSoloz

Exactly. Especially the history that makes so many far right Pennsylvanians uncomfortable because accurate history challenges their worldview

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RedneckLiberace t1_ixz5pxw wrote

We should have an exchange program with Russia. Send all these Insurrection lovers to Putin's Russia for a couple years and let them see first hand how great it is.

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Advanced-Guard-4468 t1_ixww52t wrote

The left has trouble accepting history also. They put today's standards on people that lived 200 to 2000 years ago.

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pnvrgnnltUdwn t1_ixx5ucc wrote

What’s the point in studying history if not to apply it to the present?

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Advanced-Guard-4468 t1_ixx6a21 wrote

You dont "apply" it to anything. It's to learn what happened in the past, to shape the present. You don't condem them because they don't meet current standards.

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pnvrgnnltUdwn t1_ixx6pdk wrote

Condemn who from what? They’re dead.

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Advanced-Guard-4468 t1_ixx6xet wrote

If they are dead, why the need to remove thier name and statues from the public square?

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pnvrgnnltUdwn t1_ixx7eb9 wrote

Because the public square should be for people who are admired in the community, it’s not a museum

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Advanced-Guard-4468 t1_ixx7wxm wrote

Maybe you need a history lesson of all those countries in the past that removed history from the public square. It never ends well.

Have you ever been to Rome or Greece? They still have statues standing from thousands of years ago.

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pnvrgnnltUdwn t1_ixx8l0l wrote

What like Germany? Iraq? Italy?

You’re just spouting garbage you Neanderthal

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Advanced-Guard-4468 t1_ixx8pf0 wrote

No like the Taliban.

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pnvrgnnltUdwn t1_ixx9aqh wrote

They rose to power because we (The USA) trained them and gave them weapons.

What you call history is generational propaganda

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Advanced-Guard-4468 t1_ixx9vwb wrote

They were there long before we trained them to kill the Russians in the 70s. They just expanded their territory after Russia pulled out.

The same happened in Cambodia during the 70s. There they condemned the older people to slave labor and concentration camps because they knew the history.

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BurghPuppies t1_iy0ez64 wrote

Also, I’d like to point out that the Taliban is still in power, since Trump & Pompeo surrendered Afghanistan to them. So I hasn’t “ended” for them at all.

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bk1285 t1_ixxhulg wrote

Nah see there is a difference…those people will be remembered in history textbooks and museums where they belong, not to be celebrated in public squares or by having buildings named after them

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Advanced-Guard-4468 t1_ixxk3x4 wrote

Nah, the people that help create this country should be celebrated, taught about and remembered. There's a reason older generation had buildings and places named after them.

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bk1285 t1_ixxlh1t wrote

No one who committed treason and took up arms against our country should be honored by having buildings or military installations named after them…the only honor they deserve would be having a latrine named after them. They should just consider themselves lucky the govt took a peaceful transition approach…every confederate should have been hung

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Advanced-Guard-4468 t1_ixyfv21 wrote

Who is talking about the Civil War. I'm talking about the people that made this country. You know Washington, Jefferson and Lincoln.

Oh and we needed the civil war to make it the US.

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Alex1387 t1_ixyv8uw wrote

>who is talking about the civil war

>Mentions Lincoln

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bk1285 t1_ixz3ite wrote

Who is taking Jefferson or Washington’s name off of anything?

You realize Lincoln was like almost a 100 years later than Washington and Jefferson right?

We didn’t need a civil war, the south choose to have one. If anything the southern states got off extremely lightly

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Advanced-Guard-4468 t1_ixz4gdt wrote

The Civil war was necessary to form the US. Any new States added the North wanted to prevent them from allowing them to become slave states.

Yes Im aware of the gap between the Revolution and the Civil war.

Jefferson was already removed from a school in NJ and of all colleges UVA is trying to remove his name (the college was founded by Jefferson)

San Franciscos board of Ed is removing both names George Washington and Jefferson off of buildings.

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bk1285 t1_ixza831 wrote

What is wrong with the north wanting to prevent new states that were added from being space states?

You realize the civil war was the founders fault…they did the equivalent of “fuck it the next person in can deal with this mess”

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Advanced-Guard-4468 t1_ixzc0ix wrote

I'm well aware of the why's.

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bk1285 t1_ixzc61e wrote

And don’t go pinning the civil war on the north, it was the south who was the aggressor…it was the south who decried every effort made and became hypocrites

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Advanced-Guard-4468 t1_ixze9yu wrote

Again, its your projection. The North said enough with the slavery, even though at the time states like NJ still allowed slavery

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bk1285 t1_ixzh1z3 wrote

The country never outlawed slavery as a whole until the 13th amendment…hell space states fought for the north. The border states even after the emancipation proclamation were allowed to keep their slaves as that only applied to states in rebellion to the government. Yes individual states in the north ended slavery but it wasn’t on the whole. The south became a little bitch and afraid that Lincoln would end slavery and tried to leave the union and opened war on the north. Hell for the first almost 2 years of the war, the south would have been able to rejoin the union without losing slavery…the south is the ones who in the end made it all about slavery but that’s just revisionist history on the losers part. The confederacy was a bunch of whiny brats

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susinpgh t1_ixzmbe0 wrote

I read something the other day about some laws still being on the books because they only apply to prisoners. They kept those so that legally they don't have to pay for prison labor.

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OhioJeeper t1_ixyzxr2 wrote

Hard disagree, John Brown was hung for treason.

This simple "everyone is either all good or all bad" type of thinking is exactly why we shouldn't be cutting education requirements in history and civics lol.

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noonehomenow t1_ixxyaed wrote

History is to be learned from. Whether you like it or not it's there , you can't change it., rewrite or reinterpret it. It is what it is.

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bk1285 t1_ixz3mo8 wrote

Hence their names stay where they belong, in history books and museums. Not on buildings and parks

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BurghPuppies t1_iy0etmy wrote

LOL, what? Tell me about all these countries who “removed history from the public square”, and how it precipitated their downfall. Please cite cause & effect, not just two unrelated facts. Also… please make them actual facts. I know ya’ll struggle with that.

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yadda4sure t1_ixylf0u wrote

Because you don’t celebrate shitbags. That’s what got us to this fucked up situation. Yes we learn about them and how awful they are, just like Hitler, but we don’t celebrate awful with statues.

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Advanced-Guard-4468 t1_ixylly7 wrote

You never learned about them. If you did, you wouldn't refer to them as shitbags.

We wouldn't have gotten our independence from Britain without them. But go on with tour narrow minded view.

I see the current educational system is turning out some real winners. So we need to have a stronger Social Studies and Civic lessons.

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yadda4sure t1_ixym7fg wrote

There’s a big difference between the few isolated cases where people want to remove the statues of Washington or Jackson (who HAD SLAVES) because they believed in the horrific institution of SLAVERY.

CONFEDERATE officer’s were TRAITORS of this nation.

Emphasis added for your stupidity.

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Advanced-Guard-4468 t1_ixymg6f wrote

You meant to say Jefferson (who had slaves). Anyone who studies history knows he did. It wasn't uncommon for people to do that then.

Jackson and what he did do the Cherokee Indians is just horrible.

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SeaCoffeeLuck t1_ixyrv2y wrote

Washington had slaves too. His dentures were made from real human teeth pulled from other people… likely before they were dead. There weren’t any volunteers giving him his teeth…

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Advanced-Guard-4468 t1_ixysqb0 wrote

"Likely" but no way to confirm that.

Yes he owned slaves but that wasn't uncommon for large property owners back then.

He also sacrificed much of his life for this country. He set a president by stepping down as a leader of a country which had never happened before. Was he a perfect person without flaws? Nope

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HeyZuesHChrist t1_iy0asty wrote

Jesus Christ dude. This is one of the stupidest comments I’ve ever seen on Reddit. If I were you I’d just delete your account and start over. F-

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DavidLieberMintz t1_ixynkig wrote

You watch too much fake news and it shows. Since when did teachers start class by saying "okay everyone, now pull out your monument to Jackson and let's begin." We use books, genius. Public places should be used to honor people whose values along with our society today. Don't get triggered because we decided to remove statues of traitors lmao.

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Advanced-Guard-4468 t1_ixyob30 wrote

I only mentioned Washington, Jefferson and Lincoln as people that shouldn't be removed. I'm glad you think I was talking about people I wasn't. I wouldn't classify those 3 as traitors but go on and give me a history as to why those 3 would be classified that way?

Fake news? Or propaganda? It's very difficult today to find real news sources that aren't trying to shape people's opinions instead of putting the information out there and let people come to their own conclusions. I'm old enough to remember what constitutes a journalist they are few an far between today. If they put out the real news they get hammered by either the left or right.

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HeyZuesHChrist t1_iy0ajyo wrote

Why should we honor traitors and other piles of shit by naming things after them?

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pnvrgnnltUdwn t1_ixx6skb wrote

And you’d apply what you learned to shape the present.

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Advanced-Guard-4468 t1_ixx756t wrote

The present is already shaped from the past, you correct it for the future

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pnvrgnnltUdwn t1_ixx7a9r wrote

STFU you argumentative ass. Bs about semantics because someone removed your favorite confederate statue or whatever bullshit you’re on about. Go back to parlor

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Advanced-Guard-4468 t1_ixx7gg3 wrote

Yes, Thomas Jefferson and George Washington were fine outstanding confederates /s

I'm sorry my opinion is different than yours but I won't leave reddit because you have an issue

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pnvrgnnltUdwn t1_ixyqg4c wrote

Where were statues of Jefferson or Washington removed?

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Advanced-Guard-4468 t1_ixyr3yl wrote

You could Google that but they were removed in NYC and Portland.

I guess your not as informed as you think you are. Maybe it's your news source that's keeping you ill-informed.

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pnvrgnnltUdwn t1_ixyrmeo wrote

I don’t really have a consistent news source and I don’t feel any kind of way about missing statue news in general. However, I assume you are a states rights guy; a local, small government guy, but you want to judge these people for making a decision as a community? Washington and Jefferson did nothing more than create a tax haven for other wealthy white men. They didn’t care about any other demographic. They weren’t heroes. They didn’t do any actual fighting. They sent poor farmers to war on their behalf and ripped off the Magna Carta.

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Advanced-Guard-4468 t1_ixytefc wrote

You really should do some reading on Washington. Your view of him would change after all the sacrifices he made for this country.

Yes, Washington did do fighting and those he lead volunteered to join they were only forced when they weren't being paid by congress when they were staying the winter near Morristown, NJ.

The Statues were removed by a select few not by the masses.

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BurghPuppies t1_ixyqn7j wrote

Lol. Ok. In that case, the 2nd Amendment only applies to muskets.

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Advanced-Guard-4468 t1_ixyqxwe wrote

Muskets were military grade guns in their day.

The more people post in here the more it's evident that Social Studies is truly lacking.

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BurghPuppies t1_ixz43fz wrote

Oh. So it sounds like you’re putting today’s “military grade” on the words of 250 years ago. How about that.

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Advanced-Guard-4468 t1_ixz4tum wrote

No, you are the one that wanted to limit the 2A to what was available 250 years ago. I was just pointing out the grade level of that weapon.

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BurghPuppies t1_iy0ebg5 wrote

No no no, I never said I wanted to limit anything. You were criticizing people on the left for always wanting to update things, I was just pointing out the hypocrisy by stating that unless you update bear arms to “today’s standards”, the only thing 2A would protect is muskets.

You can’t have it both ways; either the constitution and legal precedents are living breathing principles, or they’re not — We’re bound by their EXACT words. Which is it?

SPOILER ALERT: Your argument is screwed either way. Have a nice day : )

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Advanced-Guard-4468 t1_iy0htc7 wrote

No, you thought you would be cute and failed miserable. The conversation was about individuals and you tweaked it into the constitution. I know you think your smart.

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BurghPuppies t1_iy0i6xt wrote

Smart enough to know “your” from “you’re”. And the difference between “miserable” and “miserably”.

Also, I was asking you, an “individual”, to choose one. And you couldn’t because that fence you’re sitting on is jammed up your butt.

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Advanced-Guard-4468 t1_iy0jre6 wrote

No, spell checking means you're more intelligent, which isn't indicative of being smart.

I did post people's names but you were fixated on 2a.

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BurghPuppies t1_iy0m142 wrote

Oh I saw names… I just didn’t see how removing history led to their downfall. And one you listed is still in power, so….

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BurghPuppies t1_iy0makm wrote

And you still didn’t choose: update to “today’s standard” or allow people only to own muskets (the only arms protected by 2A)?

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Advanced-Guard-4468 t1_iy0o5h5 wrote

No, the constitution just says arms. It doesn't reference what type.

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BurghPuppies t1_iy0oqj4 wrote

And arms at the time were muskets. So, if you are against people applying “today’s standards”, that means we should apply the standards of when it was written. Therefore, “A well regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a Free state, the right of people to keep and bear muskets, shall not be infringed.” Using the standard of the time, of course : )

See how that works?

Next will we be debating wearing clothes made of multiple fabrics, touching a dead pig, and working on the Sabbath? Can’t wait!

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--Cr1imsoN-- t1_ixyjuao wrote

Meanwhile the right are too busy trying to be like people 2000 years ago and force those values onto everyone else…

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RedneckLiberace t1_ixz622f wrote

Go live in Russia and tell us how you love your Russian constitutional rights to bear arms and to free speech.

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RamHands t1_ixxaykw wrote

Or peoples actions from 20-30 years ago. “Oh, you’re joke was ok 20 years ago? Well it is offensive today. You’re “cancelled” you piece of shit.”

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ItsjustJim621 t1_ixxkxl4 wrote

It wasn’t ok then, and it’s not ok now. Let me know if you need help grasping that concept

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