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69FunnyNumberGuy420 t1_jbomoh4 wrote

Reply to comment by ronreadingpa in Will the cost of a central Pa. thruway reach $1B? PennDOT officials hope not by dissolutewastrel

> More lanes often do help.

 
No, they don't.
https://www.planetizen.com/definition/induced-demand

 
Read this book:
https://us.macmillan.com/books/9780865477506/suburbannation
 
In a nutshell, the problem is that our road network works on a trunk-and-feeder system. You've got a great many surface feeder streets and roads feeding into a limited number of high speed trunk highways. Adding more lanes to a freeway will not work as long as the feeder lanes exceed the trunk lanes.
 
https://dot.ca.gov/-/media/dot-media/programs/research-innovation-system-information/documents/final-reports/10-12-2015-ncst_brief_inducedtravel_cs6_v3.pdf

https://www.nytimes.com/2023/01/06/us/widen-highways-traffic.html

 
California has been adding lanes to LA-area freeways for decades at this point and it's only made traffic worse.

 
> Not going to change your mind, but pointing this out for others. Many PA residents want and demand more highways.

 
Many PA residents don't know what they actually want. What they actually want is to not spend so much time in their cars, because driving is a shitty boring chore. Adding lanes won't do that for them.

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ronreadingpa t1_jboq5ol wrote

Can't speak for California. In PA more roads and lanes often do help. I know from personal experience.

Induced demand is an issue, but not building new roads / adding lanes isn't the answer either. It needs to be a combination of better road infrastructure and other transportation options along with coordinating zoning across municipalities.

In my view, among the most promising is on-demand public transit. Instead of full-size buses running on a fixed routes, using a mix of vehicles from vans to full-size buses instead with flexible routes. Closest analogy would be Uber Pool. If done right, many would use it.

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69FunnyNumberGuy420 t1_jboqkcg wrote

> Can't speak for California. In PA more roads and lanes often do help.

 
Pennsylvania does not exist on a fundamentally different plane of existence than California, so no they don't. As any trip through the freeways in Philly will show you.
 
> but not building new roads / adding lanes isn't the answer either.

 
The answer is to remove vehicles from the road. That is the only way to alleviate traffic. Unfortunately, most Americans cannot imagine a life that doesn't involve driving alone an average of 40 miles a day.
 
> In my view, among the most promising is on-demand public transit. Instead of full-size buses running on a fixed routes, using a mix of vehicles from vans to full-size buses instead with flexible routes. Closest analogy would be Uber Pool. If done right, many would use it.

 
Congratulations, you just reinvented the jitney.

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