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0

ForsakenWebNinja OP t1_iugtc51 wrote

Unfortunately there aren’t enough vendors making high end southpaw keyboards. So I guess that means I’ll have to try myself.

Its early in the design but want to know what people think of the layout. Im also integrating a fingerprint reader for Windows Hello Login and autocomplete website passwords.

Keycaps are modeled after GMK Moonlight cause they look so damn good imo

132

turbod1ngus t1_iugton7 wrote

I hate having to take my hand off the mouse to use the numpad, I just have a TKL and keep a macro pad on the left. I'd like this layout.

78

Ping_law t1_iuguf72 wrote

The fingerprint reader sounds cool, but I reckon it might be a bit awkward in that position having to stick your finger between a couple of keys

28

ForsakenWebNinja OP t1_iuguw7x wrote

Replying to Ping_law (#372,766)

You might be right. Its not obvious from the picture but it’s also going to be raised about 10 mm above the surface. I’m thinking of just integrating a Kingston fingerprint reader. No sense reinventing the wheel. Especially since I’m not smart enough to reinvent it lol

https://www.kensington.com/p/products/data-protection/biometric/verimark-fingerprint-key-fido-u2f-2nd-factor-authentication-and-windows-hello/

8

ForsakenWebNinja OP t1_iugv14h wrote

Replying to turbod1ngus (#372,564)

Yea! My thoughts exactly. Excel is such a pain when you need to mouse around and input numbers at the same time.

Also even for gaming it moves the numpad to the left which allows for more space to move the mouse around.

I really don’t understand why southpaw keyboards aren’t more popular

33

AkDoxx t1_iugvfg6 wrote

I’d like this more without the top right key. A blocker with badge or even engraving would be nice. Having two awkward gaps because of the f13 and the exploded nav cluster kills me.

1

NickolNick t1_iugvjnw wrote

What are Art1, Art2, Art3, Art4, and Art5?

4

ForsakenWebNinja OP t1_iuh1ypi wrote

Replying to t3mb3 (#373,681)

Yea that would be ideal. I thought about doing that originally but then either the boarders or the case would have to be a pretty thick to accommodate the components. It would probably work if I knew how to design PCBs and could more tightly integrate everything but as it stands for right now I’m going to have to handwire. For this to work I also need to include a 2 port USB hub into the case. 1 port for the keyboard and the other for the fingerprint reader

9

recursiveorange t1_iuh2lhb wrote

Edit: TIL what's described below is called a 65% keyboard.

That's how I'd like your design. I'd remove the numpad and the fingerprint sensor and it could be my first mechanical keyboard. Yellow and blue go well together, I'd just use caps with a bolder font.

PS: I'd also remove F and Page Up and Page downkeys and add a Fn button.

−3

VXQN t1_iuh4kmp wrote

It's nice! I like the idea of having a fingerprint sensor too.

1

MattBoog t1_iuh5ep3 wrote

I almost made something like this, but not exploded. Just everything crammed together apart from a bit of space between numpad and the rest. I love the layout, but went with separate numpad instead. Makes it easier to switch between boards.

2

_Mr_Pretty_ t1_iuh5qjw wrote

What about having a rotary encoder somewhere?

1

Flash-Drive t1_iuh5w12 wrote

I'm sold, DM me when there's a group buy.

5

VictorHoangIV1 t1_iuh6q7m wrote

Maybe you should put the enter and stuff on the left side to inverse it

2

tyrosine87 t1_iuh779a wrote

Replying to ForsakenWebNinja (#372,925)

I think it might be because the two use cases you describe are fairly separate. For gaming, a smaller layout gives you more desk space, and for data entry, I can see a separate num pad as a valid investment.

Never hurts to have options, though. Looks good.

4

BadPWG t1_iuh7s0b wrote

Replying to turbod1ngus (#372,564)

What’s wrong with the separate numpad anyway? As far as I’m concerned my separate numpad and selection of 75’s/65’s is far more convenient and beautiful than a full size

1

humanmrpixel t1_iuh7y30 wrote

Looks cool! Wouldn't underestimate the work for the fingerprint reader, talk with some experience pcb designers about it.

1

zitandspit99 t1_iuh8345 wrote

Personally I really like the layout.

I use my keyboard for competitive gaming and work. Having navigational switches like Home and Insert is nice, but the problem is since I'm right-handed, and the nav cluster is on the right side, my mouse hand will sometimes hit against my keyboard when I'm quickly turning in FPS games.

I've more or less solved it by angling my keyboard so the left side is closer to the monitor than the right side, but having my nav cluster/keypad on the left side would also solve that issue.

All in all, I think it's a great setup, and I wish OEM's like Steelseries offered that layout.

1

banethor88 t1_iuh8qda wrote

I'm really trying to find a southpaw keyboard with the perfect layout as well. I've ordered both the EPOMAKER and Mountain Everest boards (both of which yet to arrive / use)

If you're an excel poweruser, you might find a common key combo is the CTRL + <directional> and CTRL + HOME/END keys to be used quite often. For that reason, I feel like doing away with HOME/END keys it is probably quite detrimental.

The other thing is if the arrow keys are on the right, then you probably end up having your hand off the mouse anyway, which kinds of defeats the purpose of shifting numpad to the left in the first place.

I like the delete key on the top right, that's kinda interesting.

Perhaps this layout is ideal? What do you think?

2

Run-Riot t1_iuh9mzy wrote

Get rid of Art5, stick the fingerprint sensor on the side, and include Home and End

Probably Del @ Art 5, Insert @ Del

Home @ insert, End @ fingerprint sensor

2

PackYourJammies t1_iuhadon wrote

Highly recommend inverting the numpad so the enter, +, and 0 key are placed properly for the fingers that use them

I use a left-handed numpad layout often, and I found that inverting the numbers didn’t help me, but the 0, +, and enter keys are much better for the fingers that hit them when inverted. The top row too (and the order of numbers), but those can be reconfigured without any layout change from a regular numpad

3

jeroplane t1_iuhbvik wrote

Maybe flip the numpad for left hand use?

2

MayAsWellStopLurking t1_iuhcwqo wrote

There’s a few designers I know with something similar in IC. One more couldn’t hurt.

Wind-X r2 is considering a southpaw option but that’s an f-row less keyboard.

3

phlurker t1_iuhfucb wrote

I'd be interested in it.

This (Southpaw non-flipped numpad) + exploded arrow cluster is very close to my dream layout. If an "HHKB" central part is offered as a variant, it would be a sure buy.

1

KobaltRose t1_iuhglwr wrote

Looks great! I'd love something like this in ISO. I don't really have a use for a fingerprint reader, but it's a nice addition that seems helpful.

2

Centurion832 t1_iuhih6y wrote

Replying to ForsakenWebNinja (#372,925)

> I really don’t understand why southpaw keyboards aren’t more popular

Most custom boards are 75/TKL or smaller to begin with so you’re talking about a percentage of a percentage of the possible market.

2

_Joe_Blow_ t1_iuho7gy wrote

I’ve been using southpaws for years now. The thing that I’ve surprisingly found is I prefer ones where the arrow keys are on the left side. My left hand does all the work with the num pad and arrow keys while my right can stay on the mouse unless I’m typing text. Not sure if that’s just a me preference though due to using it for Microstation keys ins back in the day rather than fully for excel which is think is the more traditional use case

1

lithigos t1_iuhqe62 wrote

my only thought with the fingerprint location is that anyone with longer fingernails might have a hard time fitting in that area. It's still the only spot that seems to fit with the more compact layout, and I guess most people using keyboards regularly probably don't have long nails like I tend to have.

1

omegamullet t1_iuhsvow wrote

cleanest way to do a southpaw numpad IMO

1

stutche t1_iuhxtaf wrote

I have a pretty small desk, I want as much mouse room as possible, and want a num pad. I'm using an 89 key board now, and southpaw might be the next logical step

1

Poschta t1_iuhzb8h wrote

Ace. I'd use this.

1

yaboylukas t1_iui25v0 wrote

Never really knew this layout existed and it’s kinda exactly what I’m looking for. Why you do this to me 🤣

3

kadeve t1_iui2i2p wrote

I simply dont understand why keyboards have a limited depth.. I would rather have the numpad on top of the default layout so I can still enjoy WASD being close to my mouse due to ergonomic reason and still have a full keyboard

1

ZobeidZuma t1_iui3gey wrote

Consider my recent design, which I'm still looking into producing in some form. . .

https://www.reddit.com/r/MechanicalKeyboards/comments/xty653/refactored_fullsize_worth_pursuing/

Mine is a bit more radical with the split spacebar and split backspace, which I am a believer in. However, it can still be completely covered with a recent GMK or NicePBT keycap set.

Note also. . . The main alphanumeric key block is fully functional, so there could be a more portable "mini" version with just that part, and it would be possible to switch between the mini and full-sized versions without any adaptation or retraining.

1

ForsakenWebNinja OP t1_iui3s5d wrote

Replying to banethor88 (#375,978)

I like it but the reason I kept the arrows on the right is because they are both used for navigation. So the way I see it, by keeping them on the right, it allows me to choose the mouse or arrow keys with my right hand and then use my left hand for data entry using the numpad

1

ZobeidZuma t1_iui4ks6 wrote

A few specific thoughts. . .

Not sure what Art1 through Art5 are supposed to be. Macro keys? I have nothing against macro keys really, but I would be thinking of other things that could fill that real estate.

I mean, I don't even see a Home or End key. Well, I guess you could put those on your function layer. . . but, oh wait, I don't see a Fn key either! Hmm.

You do have Home and End on your numpad (when Num Lock is disengaged), but you can't see them because you have no secondary legends over there. (I gripe about how those secondary legends have disappeared from so many keycap sets.)

1

raptor102888 t1_iui6e0w wrote

I don't know if I could get used to using the numpad with my left hand, personally, but I really like this layout! It'd be cool to have an option where Art5 is replaced by a knob. And what are your thoughts on making the righthand bottom row modifiers 1U, so you could have a FN key too?

1

ForsakenWebNinja OP t1_iui76i1 wrote

Replying to _Joe_Blow_ (#380,052)

Yea my reasoning was that I can use left hand for number entry and right hand for navigation using mouse or arrow keys. I’ll have to give some thought to moving the arrows over since you’re not the first to bring it up

1

PackYourJammies t1_iui7c9u wrote

Replying to ForsakenWebNinja (#385,011)

Sure! I would also recommend adding another mod to the left side that would come under C for usability (macs kind of do this, but they don’t place the mod as far over as another 1.25u key would - it’s super useful for a main mod like control because you don’t have to move your hand at all to access things like ctrl+C) and then splitting the spacebar

1

ForsakenWebNinja OP t1_iui7wyu wrote

Replying to lithigos (#380,714)

How do you type with long nails? Whenever my nails get even slightly long my typing speed and accuracy go down so I keep them short specifically for typing. The down side is opening cans becomes harder

1

ForsakenWebNinja OP t1_iui95rl wrote

Replying to ZobeidZuma (#384,993)

Thanks for the feedback. The Art keys could be whatever you want them to be. I don’t use Fn but it could be put there if you want. Art = artisanal. I just have them as placeholders for the GMK moonlight novelty keycaps

1

GL1TCH3D t1_iui9b2h wrote

Love the layout.

I'd seen 60% layouts previously with a numpad attached on the left but can't remember the name now. 75% layout + left handed numpad would be amazing.

1

UrsKaczmarek t1_iuib191 wrote

It could be useful for excel warriors, change cells with arrow keys, input values with left hand

1

Linear4life t1_iuib4ok wrote

It’s probably just me but I’m not a fan when arrow keys are a notch down

1

its_james_t t1_iuicdhx wrote

I'm in the process of making a flipped full size (kind of) basically a tkl on the left and some extra buttons and an oled for layers.

1

kleementine99 t1_iuid4ro wrote

numpads on the left should be more common, it just makes so much more sense when you want to use it and the mouse. Nice! :)

1

BanHammerGotim t1_iuietw8 wrote

It's a nice layout, but i think it would be cool to shift the f row to a cluster on the left of the numpad. Edit: hopefully there's layout options for 7u spacebar, split backspace and stepped capslock

1

UncleEnk t1_iuievvu wrote

the southpaw layout is nice but the finger print reader is weird to me because side jobs just mess up your fingerprints like soldering do it makes very little sense to me besides vanity.

1

hcddanny t1_iuig40f wrote

I love this lay-out! looking forward to it becoming a product one day!

2

CARNAGEaf t1_iuig57e wrote

Geist is making a board like this w/ a knob. Studio | ASP GB expected Q1

1

ISimpForYuri t1_iuih5ta wrote

now this is something i can get begind

2

ArmsNerd t1_iuikofg wrote

this is probably what i’d want my keyboard to be. though i suggest you mirroring the num area(enter, +, - to the left side)

1

lithigos t1_iuiktnp wrote

Replying to ForsakenWebNinja (#386,024)

yeah it's definitely slower and more prone to typos, but considering I don't need to type for my job and it's only something I do in my spare time, it's a trade off I don't mind, especially if it's not permanent. As far as other tasks like opening cans, I usually use a spoon or other tool but my nails are pretty strong with gel manicure so sometimes I can get away with it. I love switching up my nails so I go back and forth between long and short, I'm sure once i finish building my keyboard i'll probably cut them short so i can enjoy the typing experience.

1

CC-5576-03 t1_iuil5j4 wrote

If I had the money for a custom board this would be it's layout. I'm real tired of having to move take my hand off the mouse just to use the numpad.

1

spotsnap t1_iuilz8m wrote

I liked the layout for gaming + typing guys (like me), but its missing Home and End keys.

1

matskat t1_iuio4ut wrote

I'm a fan of southpaw layouts fr fr

1

ForsakenWebNinja OP t1_iuiprhj wrote

Replying to PackYourJammies (#391,372)

That’s true. Although if I’m going to go through the trouble of making my own custom board I may as well include every key I want/need. I have a terrible memory and keep forgetting combos ive configured

1

gelosphere t1_iuiqegj wrote

For real though this could work for non southpaws as well. Another interesting variation would be if the numpad had a mirrored layout. I used to hit the plus and enter with my pinkie so having it on that layout might be interesting.

1

nikkdizzle t1_iuirz5g wrote

im here for the fingerprint reader.

1

blueberry_sushi t1_iuita7v wrote

Replying to PackYourJammies (#376,355)

Yes! I've found this issue with my own attempts at using a numpad with the left hand. People frequently suggest for others to use a separate numpad and just move it to the left of your keyboard rather than having one integrated into the board itself, and the problem with that is that the numpad is designed for use with the right hand, and good luck trying to find a reversed layout numpad out there that isn't a part of an extremely limited/expensive keyboard.

To do a left-hand numpad properly, imo, the numpad layout needs to be reversed so that the thumb can rest over the '0' key, it feels really awkward and just un-ergonomic to scrunch your hand up and hit the zero with your pinky.

2

PileofBS t1_iuitmua wrote

Looks great, other people also have great suggestions. The only change I would make is to change insert key to be home/end. I use the home and end key way more often than the insert key. You could use home and then shift+home can be your end, and hide the insert keybind on another layer close by.

1

Jarmer t1_iuiv9fw wrote

This is almost exactly the same layout (but not split) as the SP111 that I use as my daily driver. Absolutely love it.

1

Mriamsosmrt t1_iuivv69 wrote

I would put 3 1u keys to the right of the spacebar instead of the 2 1.5u keys. Thta way I could have a function key for media control and a dedicated right alt and right control.

1

PileofBS t1_iuixp3b wrote

Replying to ForsakenWebNinja (#393,919)

It’s useful when you’re writing documents home will take you to the beginning of the document and end will take you to the end so you don’t have to scroll and click. When writing code home will take you to the beginning of the line and end will take you to the end. The insert key can be useful in some situations but I find the home and end keys to be used more often.

1

ForsakenWebNinja OP t1_iuiyxw3 wrote

Replying to PileofBS (#394,197)

Lol as a developer I should’ve known this 🤦‍♂️

I do use insert. Not often but enough that I included it. I’ll have to rethink the home and end key. In word processing and website I usually use PgUp and PgDn

1

LevanderFela t1_iuiz66c wrote

Geistmaschine is planning on making premium 75% with southpaw numpad

1

JReiter18 t1_iuj0hzc wrote

Always have thought keypad on left side is more user friendly tbh. no need to remove your hand from mouse or keyboard hand all the way over to input numbers quickly in like excel without moving your hand off your mouse. This on top of the fingerprint scanner this is A1 in my book

1

seventhcent t1_iuj1b9c wrote

Found a couple of these on AliExpress and thought it’d be convenient for the same reasons!

1

ThatHippieGamer t1_iuj1i0c wrote

i prefer smaller form factors myself, 65% hits that sweet spot. but you do you

1

AllThatTaz t1_iuj1m8k wrote

Yeah I'd love this for my job(data input/admin) so I can simultaneously use the mouse and numpad without lugging around my 65% and numpad separately. Always had the mindset that "welp, nobody's making them so I'll have to make one myself", I just haven't found the time to lately.

1

xLawless- t1_iuj32yc wrote

No F row and an optional Knob + Optional step capslock

1

PileofBS t1_iuj3iml wrote

Replying to ForsakenWebNinja (#394,595)

What I like to do for my small form keyboards is assign PgUP PgDN Home and End onto the arrow keys under a separate layer. You could do that here and free up two of those keys for modifiers. And leave insert where it is. Or you could do ins, home, and end on those 3 keys and move pgup and pgdn to the arrow keys. The beauty of designing your own is that you have the freedom to make these choices and pick what’s best for you!

1

Rapt0rRed t1_iuj4qtu wrote

Man you would 've loved the Viendi 8L then. Doesn't have the F-Row though. Speaking of which.. we should be getting close to shipping window soon 👀

1

PackYourJammies t1_iuj68c9 wrote

Replying to blueberry_sushi (#392,787)

Yes exactly using pinky 0 on a right-handed numpad with your left keyboard is awful. The + and enter placement isn’t as bad for the thumb, but I still greatly prefer it on the left for use with the pinky or ring finger

Also this is an elaborate solution, but you could try something like it. I use the left half of a split ortholinear keyboard (Keebio FoldKB) for a lefty numpad with the 0 set to the spacebar 1.25u mod to the left of the spacebar. It works really well other than having 1u keys for + and enter (I use 2 for + and 1 for enter). A macropad also might fit you

Edit: edited “spacebar” to the mod next to it

2

ForsakenWebNinja OP t1_iuj9mtf wrote

Replying to LevanderFela (#397,404)

Oh wow I’m bookmarking that site. That’s awesome! As for the keyboard I don’t know why the name you used didn’t register in my brain. I was looking at this board yesterday. I really like it a lot. I hope to get one

1

Blue-Bird780 t1_iujal0i wrote

My boss asked me “are you a lefty?” When I was using a calculator with my left hand to process manual paperwork (I know it’s a sin in 2022 but here we are). I said “no, I’m just efficient, I can type without looking and still use the pen in my right hand. If I could, I’d have the numpad of my keyboard on the left too”

This answers my prayers. A fingerprint reader compatible with Windows Hello would just be to die for.

2

Run-Riot t1_iujd9g0 wrote

Replying to ForsakenWebNinja (#384,864)

Get to the top/bottom of a page, get to the beginning/end of a line when entering data/coding, activates End Mode in Excel, probably more things I can't think of right now

Seems like I'm in the minority of using them though, because a lot of 75% keyboards seem to omit one or both, especially if they're DIY kits

Your layout would be great for me if it were that way and with tri-mode though. Would save me the hassle of having to have a separate num pad plugged in to put on the left side of my keyboard while my keyboard is wireless (currently using an Akko 75% that way)

2

_Cymen_ t1_iuje3ws wrote

Yes, this is exactly what I'm looking for!

2

Rinich t1_iujirct wrote

my literal dream

2

mrhoneybunz t1_iujkcf3 wrote

glad people are designing more southpaws, its a very niche layout and its very expensive to find one. if i didnt have my wyvern id purchase this cuz i love 75%!

1

kevinvo t1_iujqe3j wrote

As someone who likes to game and use the num pad for work, I would love this! I would just have to get used to using the num pad with my left hand lol

1

Haktic t1_iujs14d wrote

I was searching hard for one of these and decided to get id80 and a num pad on the left bc I couldn't find a better solution.

1

TierneyColin t1_iujs75k wrote

Never used a num pad with my left hand, nor do I think many others have, and I’m not totally sure I’d be able to get used to it

1

Joe_Scotto t1_iujwlvg wrote

My only thought is that it’s way too many keys.

36keygang

1

wdpgn t1_iujxr2z wrote

Nice! Been looking for just this layout.

Keep an eye out for the Keychron Q12 in coming months. No fingerprint sensor but otherwise very similar.

1

quantumlocke t1_iuk237c wrote

Just want to throw this out there - the standard navigation column on the 65% layout is 4 keys top to bottom. Maybe I'm alone on this, but I actually use all of those nav column keys.

Nothing personal, but I hate that so many KB designs just willy nilly drop 1 or more of those keys. I mean, I see that you have a fingerprint reader, but there are, not exaggerating, 20 other keys on this layout that I'd rather see dropped first to fit in a fingerprint reader, logo, badge, etc. There are so many boards I've passed on because they prioritize other stuff over the basic functionality of having a complete layout. Yeah, it's just one key, but that's a key I use daily.

1

coatochi t1_iuk43gy wrote

Perfect! Just need the enter key on the numpad all the way to the right

1

OniCado t1_iuk6f7r wrote

Replying to ForsakenWebNinja (#372,464)

been looking for a 75% or TKL w/ numpad on the left for ages, now if theres a version w/ short LShift and possibly split backspace which also has >=1kHz poll and scanrate there's nothing more i can ask for

1

MachineDoctor t1_iuk6j6h wrote

I like this.

Might consider switching the Delete Key and Art 5. Art 5 could be like an F13 (like on Novelkeys TKL)

I have a TKL at home with a separate Num Pad on the left (I hate giving up the mouse to put numbers in). Am building a Rekt1800 ( I know, still right handed) for work but could be persuaded to route it to someone else for an ideal southpaw.

What are your plans beyond the layout?

Incline? Plate? PCB (Solder/Hotswap)? Weight? Colors? QMK/VIA?

FWIW, I really would like a true full size (i.e. cursor keys and PUp/PDown/Home/Insert/Delete on the left between the NumPad and primary keys). That would be my ideal board. I tried an Epomaker 96% Southpaw and didn't like the tight grouping of keys.

I wish you luck on your project and hope to see your updates on progress!

1

ForsakenWebNinja OP t1_iuk6y3f wrote

Replying to wdpgn (#408,915)

Oh it’s ok I didn’t take your comment to mean that. I’m making the keyboard because almost no one’s making nice southpaw boards. I’d rather buy it than make it myself but since if a company makes them I’ll buy them

2

MachineDoctor t1_iuk79ui wrote

Replying to banethor88 (#375,978)

The link you pasted is almost exactly what I have been looking for. Don't want ISO but this is VERY close.

Good point about the Home and End keys. I use Excel a LOT and wouldn't want to do without them,

Still would like the cursor keys sitting like they are in your link.

I have an Epomaker Southpaw. Only used it for an hour and realized it wasn't for me. It is sitting somewhere in Mech Market.....

2