Stop The CorruptionSubmitted by sillychillly t3_y7doiu in Maine
GoggleField t1_isu1g19 wrote
Reply to comment by indyaj in Stop The Corruption by sillychillly
Too bad our system of government is based on political capital and not, like, doing good stuff.
mike_hawk_420 t1_isxaclq wrote
They should be paid based off our gdp or something. If they help the country grow, they make more. And they are not allowed to take any outside money
Squidworth89 t1_isu262d wrote
Define “good stuff”
Cause this isn’t a good idea. Way to ostracize even more people from public office. Can’t retire off government bonds.
Bywater t1_isu3aps wrote
You really defending politicians engaging in insider trading and allowing them to make decisions based on stocks because they don't get paid enough? Holy fucking Stockholm syndrome Batman.
TheFangjangler t1_isuu06o wrote
Some people just really like deep throating that Capitalist boot.
Independent-Ruin-185 t1_isugghe wrote
I'm not mad about insider trading. I'm mad that I don't have the networking connections to do it myself. We're all human. I know it sounds good to say I would never do that but the reality is a substantial amount of people would partake in insider trading if they had the ability to.
I already posted something similar but he does have a good point. Government pay sucks. After talking to some of my state senators and my local representatives I realized that it really sucks. The really smart people go private sector, we get the second stringers because of the graft. You get rid of the graft we're really going to have even worse politicians.
Obviously there's exceptions to the rule, looking at you Bernie. But those politicians are the exception, not the rule
Random-Rambling t1_isuinh5 wrote
So what should we do?
If we pay gov't employees more, you get greedy bastards only in the job for the money. If we pay them less, you get...even greedier bastards who manipulate the system for more money.
Bywater t1_isujm03 wrote
The problem now is that we have way to much hierarchy and far to little accountability. Those we elect to represent us tend to just represent whatever will make them the most money to get back in office so they can continue to profit off that position of trust.
Independent-Ruin-185 t1_isujy41 wrote
Off the cuff maybe we could offer voter based incentives. Annually after election the constituents can vote whether or not the official earned a bonus.
I don't mind greedy bastards. Money, shame and pride are powerful motivations.
Unpopular opinion but I'd like to just pay them more. Like I said I don't mind if they're just in it for the money as long as they're the best at what they do. Elected official is a job and most people want the best paying job they can get which leaves us with people who couldn't cut it in the private sector.
Bywater t1_isuifsn wrote
I ditched all my stocks decades ago, that shit more rigged than a casino.
Saying "Government pay sucks" considering the current state of economic affairs makes you sound both privileged and completely out of fucking touch. Even if you ignore the fact that they still get a pension saying that people who get paid 5 and a half times the median income in our country get a free pass on corruption because that is how you get good people is peak fuckwit.
I swear the number of people who are content to be ruled and allow those in power to have their own set of laws is why we are in such a bad way. Defending their ability to engage in insider trades, and even own stocks for company they make decisions on is an ethical nightmare, that you can't see that shit is speaks to how effective propaganda is on some folks gullibility. But hey, some folks cool with people taking classified documents home from work with them, so I guess I should not be surprised anymore.
Independent-Ruin-185 t1_isulmls wrote
Ad hominem is not the way to get anyone to respect your opinion. You realize you can't murder the opposition you have to sway them to your side with articulate arguments. You ever won a debate by calling the other person a fuckwit?
State senators make less than $16k a year. Substantially below the poverty level. So yes government pay sucks. If you're surviving on less than that every year please share how you're doing yet. It's not an automatic pension, I don't know what you're getting that information.
You make a really poor argument. What are you talking about with classified documents? Are you one of these right wingers that believes everyone is guilty until proven innocent?
If you're off stocks what makes up your IRA? Genuine question, mine is almost entirely VOO with a little VXUS. Always interested in how to diversify
Bywater t1_isunrt1 wrote
I was describing you, if you found it to be insulting maybe you should reflect on that. As for respecting my opinion, do what you want, but I have long since given up on reaching most people who are so committed to whatever it is they decided to believe in that they lack the strength to challenge their own beliefs regardless of the information they are presented with.
I firmly believe that if you use your position of power to make a single dollar by violating your oath and the trust of those you represent that you should not be in office. As you came out saying that they have no choice but to do this and survive, despite how much better off they are than 90% of Americans, to defend that corruption? Ya, with as deep as you are in that bubble I know I will never be able to pop it. I mean even with the 16k we pay our reps (it varies by state) as they work less than half a year they are still above the median, but lets not let that get in the way of some kind of clear repetition of Dan Crenshaw's talking points to defend his millions he made.
Gayasskat t1_isuolhh wrote
I mean yeah if I had the ability to rob a bank and have no repercussions I would do it. Doesn't mean it should be legal lmao
c4boom13 t1_isutb5t wrote
State Congress is SIGNIFICANTLY different than Federal Congress. Federally all members make $174k or more as their pay. Considering Congressional sessions are not a full time job (the rest of the year they spend fundraising for re-election which doesn't count), that is plenty for them to live very comfortably. They just want MORE. If they want to play the stock market and build personal wealth, they can retire from Congress.
Independent-Ruin-185 t1_isuytir wrote
I'm not disagreeing with you. At some point I'm going to fact check that $174k is enough to live comfortably in DC but for now I'll go along with it.
Everybody wants more. You say that like it's an accusation of wrongdoing when wanting more is the American dream.
On a federal level they're making about what a programmer who took a 6 month boot camp makes a year. 166k average vs 174k.
They live in spotlight under constant scrutiny, at any given time probably a third of the country hates them no matter how good a job they're doing.
I'm fine with getting rid of the graft but you have to bump up the salary or as I said we're going to get even worse politicians than we have now.
TarantinoFan23 t1_isuikwz wrote
Lol, thats terrible logic. The solution is pull you cheeks apart so it doesn't hurt so bad?
Independent-Ruin-185 t1_isum1c1 wrote
Dude.. I'll debate with you all day but if you're going to shit post with no kind of articulate response I'm going to bail.
Do you talk to people like this at the pub or when you're volunteering for GOTV?
TarantinoFan23 t1_isute6i wrote
Could you show me some legislation that would meet your stamp of approval?
Independent-Ruin-185 t1_isuxaxg wrote
Death with Dignity is legislation that gets my stamp of approval. Granted they waited to pass it until after we put it on the ballot but a win is a win.
Edit: haha you win, you baited me into a reply after I said I was out if you kept up like this.
TarantinoFan23 t1_isv0nur wrote
Intresting. I am opposed to assisted suicide because it only benefits the survivors (family), which seems like a slippery slope. And the fact that we only assume that death ends the suffering of the person who dies.
Attackcamel8432 t1_isu38s3 wrote
This might sound nutty, but people who get into government for the money might not be the people we want there...
Squidworth89 t1_isu45gl wrote
You're missing the point.
You need to be able to invest in equites in order to retire.
Bond yields are nothing.
If you want good people in office you shouldn't disincentivize them.
Attackcamel8432 t1_isu4os9 wrote
Or a pension... normal people investing for their retirement is a relatively new thing.
Squidworth89 t1_isu58o3 wrote
Pensions are getting rarer and rarer.
Shouldn't be... but is the reality of it... they're only failing because the companies/government entities didn't properly fund them in past decades and unions got gutted.
Attackcamel8432 t1_isu5rjs wrote
True enough. You aren't wrong about incentives for lawmakers, but they definitely have to be the right ones.
Squidworth89 t1_isu6z1l wrote
Not so much for the lawmakers but for those looking to try to be one...
Do they have decent salaries? Yes. Are those salaries huge? Not by DC standards.
I personally would be hard pressed to ever run for office if I couldn't invest in equities. Social security is a joke. Bond yields are terrible. I've never been offered a pension. Have no choice but equities.
There should be reform but most pushing the narrative "it's insider trading rawr rawr rawr!" don't grasp the subject matter beyond the headline.
Plus... there's many far more important things we keep kicking the can on...
MaineHippo83 t1_iswoao2 wrote
You keep failing to realize that you can invest in equities and prevent corruption.
Mutual funds and/or blind trusts
Ok-Pomegranate6336 t1_isx53f9 wrote
Yes, exactly.
Squidworth89 t1_isx8fo8 wrote
Those are terrible alternatives.
MaineHippo83 t1_isxbho1 wrote
Disagree. It's what most americans are invested in and a safe long term investment strategy. Look up bogleheads.
Most people will not beat the market over the long term.
Squidworth89 t1_isxdcpc wrote
Boggleheads is a very basic community. Haven’t been there in prolly a decade. I’m assuming they haven’t changed much.
Friendly-Seaweed-250 t1_isu4pnv wrote
You have a smooth brain and a taste for licking boots
Squidworth89 t1_isu5g24 wrote
That's all you've got?
Feel free to educate yourself on the matter and try again. Or continue living in ignorance... I hear it's bliss.
GoggleField t1_isu75gu wrote
There are ways to invest in equities without taking advantage of insider knowledge. It's not one or the other. You could certainly make the point that Golden is over generalizing, but the intention is a good one.
Squidworth89 t1_isu8r3a wrote
Yeah you can use index funds or mutual funds...
But imo those are trash. I do feel there will eventually be an index fund bubble (they buy indiscriminately, and eventually that'll artificially inflate certain things that will eventually have to pop). And mutual fund managers are really not that good at managing funds.
For starters they could simply enforce the reporting requirements... which they really don't.
Intention is debatable. It does nothing for the people. To me it's simply pandering for votes. There's far more important matters out there.
TarantinoFan23 t1_isuj6n2 wrote
You're insinuating that this is literally the only legislation Golden is working on?
Squidworth89 t1_isukmme wrote
I'm insinuating the only real purpose behind this legislation is for him to score political points at home as he panders for votes in the upcoming election.
TarantinoFan23 t1_isum99f wrote
What is the difference between legislation that has broad support and legislation that is just to score political points?
Squidworth89 t1_isumz7n wrote
Something that actually matters...
This one means nothing for you and I.
Address basic rights for women, or lagging wages, or the terribly broken medical system and maybe he'd deserve those votes.
But pandering on misunderstood and inflated word salad... he might as well be a MTG who does equally as much nothing in office.
Laeek t1_isu9p5c wrote
So let them invest in index funds. Less than one percent of Americans are active traders. Active trading isn't necessary for financial security, and the thing people have issue with is "insider trading" (used colloquially) like members of congress buying stock in specific American chip manufacturers before they vote to give the industry a subsidy.
Plus members of congress get a pension and lifetime health insurance, in addition to a generous salary while in office. You're either making your argument without knowing how members of congress are compensated or you're being disingenuous.
Squidworth89 t1_isuh6g2 wrote
You guys cannot even keep your definitions straight.
The "Less than 1%" you're referring to is day trading. That has nothing to do with the conversation.
Just because someone buys stock in specific companies doesn't mean it's insider trading, or day trading, or whatever else ppl come up with.
They get a decent salary while in office for DC. Not something I would give up access to stocks for.
lucianbelew t1_iswvb90 wrote
Oh. I get it. This is a parody of someone so profoundly stupid that they can't imagine common sense provisions like allowing for investment in target date funds or blind trusts.
Well done! You almost had me there.
Squidworth89 t1_isx8iek wrote
Target date funds are a rip-off sold to the ignorant.
Blind trusts… who blindly gives up control of their funds?
lucianbelew t1_isxaelm wrote
Excellent twist on that parody of a profoundly stupid human being. Keep it up if it makes you happy!
Squidworth89 t1_isxanad wrote
You should try actually educating yourself on the subject matter at hand. You wouldn’t be so bitter about it if you grasped the basics.
lucianbelew t1_isxbg6u wrote
Ain't nobody bitter over here, bub.
JBunds72 t1_isu38au wrote
I don’t think anyone in congress is really hurting for money lol, if it stops the ridiculous insider trading that both sides egregiously do, I’m all for it
Squidworth89 t1_isu4by4 wrote
Insider trading is a legal term; of which this is not it.
Is it shady? Sure. But we don't need to be disincentivizing decent people from trying to get into office. Bonds are trash for retirement planning these days.
Silktrocity t1_isvibm4 wrote
Get a grip bro. You're shilling for people that give zero fucks about you.
Squidworth89 t1_isviwtm wrote
You sound bitter. Maybe it’s you that needs the grip.
MaineHippo83 t1_iswo7uo wrote
No but I'd be doing quite well making 174k a year.
This is about actively trading individual stocks not broad market mutual funds.l
Squidworth89 t1_isx8eki wrote
No this is about equities. Learn the proper definitions.
$174k isn’t glamorous for DC.
MaineHippo83 t1_isxbmym wrote
I lived in NOVA for years making between 49-72k and owned a home. That was starting out in my career. Making 174K I'd be doing very well. You have a very limited view of how many live in the DMV, you don't need a McMansion to live a good life.
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