Submitted by blabboy t3_11ffg1u in MachineLearning
bushrod t1_jajecpg wrote
Reply to comment by RathSauce in [D] Blake Lemoine: I Worked on Google's AI. My Fears Are Coming True. by blabboy
I agree with your point, but playing devil's advocate, isn't it possible the AIs we end up creating may have a much different, "unnatural" type of consciousness? How do we know there isn't a "burst" of consciousness whenever ChatGPT (or its more advanced future offspring) answers a question? Even if we make AIs that closely imitate the human brain in silicon and can imagine, perceive, plan, dream, etc, theoretically we could just pause their state similarly to how ChatGPT pauses when not responding to a query. It's analogous to putting someone under anaesthesia.
RathSauce t1_jajjwtu wrote
I'll say up top, there is no manner to answer anything you have put forth in regards to consciousness until there is a definition for consciousness. So, apologies if you find these answers wanting or unsatisfying, but until there is a testable and consistent definition of consciousness, there is no way to improve them.
> isn't it possible the AIs we end up creating may have a much different, "unnatural" type of consciousness?
Sure, but we aren't discussing the future or AGI, we are discussing LLMs. My comment has nothing to do with AGI but yes, that is a possibility in the future.
> How do we know there isn't a "burst" of consciousness whenever ChatGPT (or its more advanced future offspring) answers a question?
Because that isn't how feed-forward, deep neural networks function regardless of the base operation (transformer, convolution, recurrent cell, etc.). We are optimizing parameters following statistical methods that produce outputs - outputs that are designed to closely match the ground truth. ChatGPT is, broadly, trained to align well with a human; the fact that it sounds like a human shouldn't be surprising nor convince anyone of consciousness.
Addressing a "burst of consciousness", why has this conversation never extended to other large neural networks in other domains? There are plenty of advanced types of deep neural networks for many problems - take ViT's for image segmentation. ViT models can be over a billion parameters, and yet, not a single person has once ever proposed ViT's are conscious. So, why is this? Likely, because it is harder to anthropomorphize the end problem of a ViT (a segmented image) than it is to anthropomorphize the output of a chatbot (a string of characters). If someone is convinced that ChatGPT is conscious, that is their prerogative but they should also consider all neural network of a certain capacity as conscious to be self-consistent with that thought.
> Even if we make AIs that closely imitate the human brain in silicon and can imagine, perceive, plan, dream, etc, theoretically we could just pause their state similarly to how ChatGPT pauses when not responding to a query. It's analogous to putting someone under anesthesia.
Even under anesthesia, all animals produce meaningful neural signals. ChatGPT is not analogous to putting a human under anesthesia.
What-Fries-Beneath t1_jak4iwk wrote
>I'll say up top, there is no manner to answer anything you have put forth in regards to consciousness until there is a definition for consciousness.
Please stop saying this. Consciousness is an internal representation of the world which incorporates an awareness of self. It's a dynamic computation of self in the world. I wish people would stop saying "we don't have a definition of consciousness". There are questions around exactly how it arises. However there are some extremely well evidenced theories. My personal favorite is Action Based Consciousness.
RathSauce t1_jak781t wrote
>So, apologies if you find these answers wanting or unsatisfying, but until there is a testable and consistent definition of consciousness, there is no way to improve them.
There is the full quote, what experiment do you propose to prove that the statement you provided is the correct, and only, definition of consciousness? If this cannot be proven experimentally, it is not a definition, it is just your belief.
If the statement cannot be proven, then people need to stop stating that consciousness has arisen in a computer program. If there is no method to prove/disprove your statement in an external system, it cannot be a definition, a fact, or even a hypothesis.
What-Fries-Beneath t1_jak8reh wrote
If you leave philosophy and spirituality out of it there is no debate on the definition of consciousness. It isn't that complicated.
>Consciousness is an internal representation of the world which incorporates an awareness of self. It's a dynamic computation of self in the world.
Plenty of citations in that paper for you to explore the idea from a scientific perspective. Edit: also plenty of experiments.
[deleted] t1_jak93ni wrote
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bigfish_in_smallpond t1_jajuuhl wrote
I think we will eventually discover that consciousness is closely tied to the brain's ability to interact on a quantum level with the real world and that maintaining the unique superposition of quantum states is what is unique. Any discrete silicon-based computer will only be an approximation of that at best.
What-Fries-Beneath t1_jak1ih6 wrote
Quantum consciousness has always been hokum and is extremely likely to remain so
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