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[deleted] t1_j17eyqu wrote

Reply to comment by ifelloffatrain in [image] by _Cautious_Memory

Dying to know also

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LoyaltyViscount t1_j185dzo wrote

I found the Reversal of Desire from The Tools really useful for this.

It’s from the psychologist Phil Stutz. Jonah Hill made a documentary about him which is on netflix.

The idea is that when you’re procrastinating you’re avoiding some sort of pain, so visualise the pain associated with the thing you’re avoiding and face toward it. Then shout “Bring it on!” and move into (in your mind).

This has been hands down the most effective tactic for tackling procrastination for me (historically, a chronic procrastinator).

EDIT: you can search Reversal of Desire on google for a better description than I just gave

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OliviaWyrick t1_j18f5ua wrote

This is the kind of advice that is just the right amount of ridiculous that I actually think it might work and I'm gonna try it...And probably look/feel like an idiot while my adhd brain is laughing at my feeble attempts to wrest control.

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ph1294 t1_j193pqn wrote

You know this is a trick commonly taught to special forces in the military, right?

It’s called embracing the suck.

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Rayne-Neverender t1_j19nfs9 wrote

I struggle with ADHD too. I'm still far from perfect but being mindful of things like fears. Facing them. Working with your brain instead of fighting it, and importantly trying to enjoy or appreciate your own effort helps. My basic understanding is we literally struggle with dopamine. Trying to pair dopamine with effort helps a lot. Fighting our brain just gives us less control. It's telling your brain that your brain is a threat which just makes things worse.

I out loud even at times tell myself "I'm trying. That's all I can do especially with my brain. Any effort is good and should be celebrated" has massively helped me. If anyone tells you you're not doing your best don't listen. One of the worst things to tell a neurodivergent person.

That mindset also helped with my self esteem. Even if my fears are true and I'm being a terrible person by not doing something, like not controlling my brain, giving myself the ability to appreciate my effort will help me change.

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OliviaWyrick t1_j1a25e8 wrote

I appreciate you. And also, I dream of the day when I could show myself that kind of grace. It's like...if I fail at the thing(s) I'm trying to accomplish in life, then I will have nothing else to live for. That feels like a much scarier place to be than where I am now, because at least there's still a part of me that's fighting. If I'm merely here to survive, I will not make it.

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LoyaltyViscount t1_j1aiqve wrote

I also have adhd, this has helped me get into that hyper-focused state for things I didn’t want to do.

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Keepa1 t1_j18r86q wrote

How do you visualise the pain? Like, imagine it as some sort of entity or being and go take it by the horns? That's all well and good but after my imaginary superhero battle I've still got a project to finish.

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ph1294 t1_j1946s3 wrote

You literally imagine the bad thing happening, and instead of saying “I don’t want that” you say “Bring it on!”

20 mile run in the rain, gonna be drenched and sore by the time it’s over? Bring it on!

Spending the next 3 hours on a project while your friends party it up, staring out the window wishing you were with them? Bring it on! That all you got? That’s nothing! Think that’ll beat me? Yeah right!

You get the idea?

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Brunosius t1_j19r8rd wrote

It sounds like you’re saying “force yourself to do it, even if you don’t want to do it”. Easier said then done.

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ph1294 t1_j19v2lt wrote

If that’s all you hear then you’ll always have that excuse ready on hand.

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Brunosius t1_j19vgbb wrote

So I have to stop making excuses and interpret advice differently. How? Is there anything I can practice or train myself to do to overcome this?

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ph1294 t1_j19z7g9 wrote

You’re not approaching the problem from an honest position right now.

You said I just told you to force yourself to do it- but that’s not what I said.

I said you need to embrace the suck - to look at all the terrible aspects of what you don’t want to do (what you are procrastinating), and choose to enjoy those things.

I think your choice to read that advice as “force yourself” is ultimately your own decision. You’re not wrong, in that you ultimately do have to ‘force’ yourself to do things, but you’re using that aspect of the action as an excuse to ultimately walk to “I can’t do it” by route of “easier said than done -> it’s very hard -> it’s too difficult for me”

Embracing the suck is a way to motivate yourself - you tell yourself that yeah this sucks, but it’s a GOOD thing that it sucks. It means you’re doing something most people wouldn’t want to because you’re willing to face up to the challenge. Suck means you’re on the right path. It’s a teacher, if you’re willing to learn from it.

But yea, ultimately it’s still just forcing yourself. (I’m not saying that’s what I told you, I’m saying that’s what’s under the skin of the reality of motivation/determination) That’s true for everyone, and it’s true that the road will be harder for some than others. If it’s harder for you to overcome procrastination, you can embrace that suck too. “I have to work that much harder to overcome procrastination, it means I’m that much stronger than the people who had it easy from the start. I have an advantage over them in knowing how to manage distraction. Obstacles that would crush them I can overcome thanks to the suck I had to face.”

Or you can just spit out “easier said than done” and call it a day. 🤷‍♂️

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Brunosius t1_j1a0d23 wrote

I don’t understand. You’re saying it isn’t forcing myself, but it is ultimately forcing myself to “embrace the suck”. That sounds like you’re saying, don’t think of it that way, but it totally is that way, but because you’re thinking of it that way you’ll never overcome it and just fall back on excuses. It’s terribly confusing and frustrating. And still not really helping or explaining how to overcome the urge to not “embrace the suck”.

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ph1294 t1_j1a249e wrote

You get it and just said it yourself.

Do you like cheese? Do you think of eating cheese as eating basically moldy/expired milk? No, you think of it as tasty cheese that can be put in a sandwich or spread on a cracker.

You think of things one-way-or-the-other all the time. Your perception often doesn’t align with reality.

What’s wrong with manually tweaking your perspective to induce results? All it is is saying “I’m not forcing myself because I love doing things that suck” until it becomes true.

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Brunosius t1_j1a2csn wrote

That’s something that could work. Thank you. I’ll give it a try.

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ph1294 t1_j1a2hrn wrote

Good luck! It’s worked wonders for me, I hope it does the same for you too :)

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[deleted] t1_j19ws5g wrote

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ph1294 t1_j19zzcx wrote

Embrace the things that make life difficult for they are also the things that will teach you the most and make you stronger.

Every challenge you face is an opportunity to improve, every struggle makes you stronger.

It’s not forcing yourself to do a thing because “you know it’s good for you”. It’s seeing that a thing is challenging, knowing that means it’s a growth path, and getting excited for the suffering itself because you know it will reap rewards.

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[deleted] t1_j1a1iy0 wrote

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ph1294 t1_j1a2fqa wrote

It’s the latter - you can be inspired by suffering.

Failure is just one step on the road to success. Worst case, you’re learning what isn’t for you. But it’s important to keep at the things you do want as well, because you wont see success if you just quit right away.

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[deleted] t1_j1a3bab wrote

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ph1294 t1_j1a5fdh wrote

What is it about suffering that makes you so unhappy?

Suffering is how you achieve great things. You should be happy to suffer, it means you’re pushing for something important.

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[deleted] t1_j1a93rt wrote

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ph1294 t1_j1acyhk wrote

That’s the secret hack nobody wants to tell you ;)

Honestly, suffering is pain and hardship. Of course it isn’t fun.

But the pain isn’t there for no reason. It’s a means to an end. You don’t get strong by not going to the gym, and you don’t go to the gym and not suffer. When people say they feel good during a workout, they don’t mean it it’s a comfortable or entertaining experience - they mean they recognize that the suffering is producing results and they feel accordingly.

Whatever it is you have to do, it might not be enjoyable in the present moment, but you can always find enjoyment in the fact that suffering means you’re doing something nessecary and becoming better for it.

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[deleted] t1_j1aevvc wrote

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ph1294 t1_j1auugf wrote

Okay, I think you make some important points. Let’s follow those thoughts:

When trying for weight loss, how many different strategies have you tried? How long do you spend on a strategy? Fitness can be an incredibly difficult mountain to climb because what works for one won’t wont for the other, and results take unusually long to materialize.

Why is your first thought upon failure “I suck and can’t progress.” Why not actively change that to “I now know what doesn’t work and get the opportunity to try a different strategy!”

Leisure should be fun. But leisure time isn’t productive time. Furthermore, think about how productive you had to be to turn those things into leisure! Was your first book easy? How long did it take you to truly appreciate literature and film? Do your opinions continue to grow and mature as you consume? Does it come freely, or does it take effort? You may be naturally inclined to these things, but nobody is born knowing how to read, nobody is born a movie buff, and it took time and effort to build those skills which you aren’t recognizing because they’re so trivial to you now.

If you want to grow, you have to work. And it sounds to me like the thing that’s really got you unhappy is the fact that everyone around you seems to be growing effortlessly. Hint: they aren’t. Everyone you know who is growing is working hard at it. Even if they’re a natural at what they’re doing, they’re working. (The best-of-the-best synergize between hard work and natural skill to get further than anyone else can)

The best way to see it is to join someone on a growth path. If the gym is a big one for you, get a gym buddy. Every time you feel like someone is watching you, frankly, remind yourself they aren’t, but also know that overcoming their gaze, or even their feeling of a gaze, is a challenge worth tackling.

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[deleted] t1_j1ax1in wrote

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ph1294 t1_j1axyik wrote

this is all perspective, I can’t fix you refusing to see that.

There’s no such thing as a fool proof fitness plan - anybody who tells you that is trying to sell you something.

If you’re comparing your fitness level to your gym buddy, you’re setting yourself up for failure. You have your suck, they have theirs. It’s two different things. Besides, I bet none of your workout buddies had the same critical thoughts about films and books you brought with you into the gym.

All of these complaints are opportunities if you view them that way.

Why do you care if people are looking? Does it make any difference if they are or aren’t?

Maybe a traditional gym isn’t right for you - can’t say you’ve tried everything until you’ve tried something else. Have you been boxing? Swimming? Tennis? HEMA? (Guarantee you’ve never done the last one!)

This is all your choice, to view things as you do. They’re either problems to make life miserable, or challenges to be overcome and destroyed. The choice is yours.

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ph1294 t1_j1b6ifk wrote

All this isn’t to say I don’t empathize with struggling. We all struggle. I struggle with my weight too.

But it’s not about whether or not you struggle - it’s about how you handle your struggle. Mindset can be just as difficult and valid a struggle as exercise or dating or work or anything else.

Maybe it’s worth it to find a smaller challenge first, with more immediate results to try the “embrace the suck” mindset on?

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LoyaltyViscount t1_j1aihdj wrote

I don’t imagine the painful event, so much as the pain that will come with that event. Don’t want to do my taxes? Imagine the pain of boredom, imagine how that feels in my body. Then turn that “feeling” as a cloud in my head (takes a bit of creativity) and face it.

“Bring it on”, I say to that cloud, those feelings - not necessarily to the prospect of doing my taxes.

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luncheroo t1_j19wqfm wrote

I try to use a version of breaking things down into really tiny steps, and sometimes when I get a few steps ticked off on something I can slip into hyperfocus and then all of a sudden I'm deep into a task that doesn't seem as daunting anymore.

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