CAElite t1_iykgu1h wrote on December 2, 2022 at 1:36 AM

ULEZ is about keeping the working poor off of the roads.

It doesn't discourage oversized single occupancy vehicle use.

It doesn't encourage public transport/EV use.

It simply charges people who cannot afford a new car (petrol/gas newer than 2005ish, diesel newer than 2016ish, 50% of cars sold 2010-2016 where diesel in the UK, and where previously encourage as the environmentally friendly/economic option).

Would like to remind US posters that cars in the UK are heavily taxed, and our wages are far lower on average than most US cities, even in London, ~$30-40k is average, so simply upgrading is a difficult option for many.

oli_g89 t1_iylhthb wrote on December 2, 2022 at 7:20 AM

Finally, a sensible comment, a couple of other things to add for non-UK residents:

Fiestly is how well maintained cars need to be to pass the regular MOT vehicle checks required to drive on UK roads, so even if someone is driving a small 2000-2010s diesel (as was recommended at the time) it's not belching clouds of smoke, and is generally mechanically pretty healthy.

And secondly how a large proportion of the vehicles affected by this zone-embiggening are actually vital secondary modes of transport for families who already primarily use public transport. I grew up in (an admittedly better-connected suburb of) London and while most families made use of trains/buses/tubes for commuting, school, and habitual travel - they all had a small/medium sized car for ad-hoc things like a big weekly food shops, transporting bigger loads, and all the routes that are just plain bad to do on public transport - London's rail is a hub and spoke model which sucks more the further out you go (trying to get from spoke to adjacent spoke).

Now almost all of those families, who have been carefully maintaining their car for the few trips they need (including those who's kids have flown the nest) need to buy new cars to continue.

CAElite t1_iym0t4m wrote on December 2, 2022 at 11:48 AM

At least London has public transport options, personally I find the implementation here in Glasgow to be more heinous as the city serves a large portion of rural Scotland, and commuting options outside of a car are just non-existent. The measure posed here is also more stringent with far less exemptions & a larger fine. In one of the poorest cities in the UK.

For me working just south of Glasgow city centre I’m a 35 minute drive, costing about £6 in diesel both ways, or a 1 hour 15min train with a £14 on peak return cost.

I believe Manchester had similar issues but their local authority was surprisingly able to listen to reason & scrapped the plan.