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acatnamedrupert t1_iwd32rv wrote

Reply to comment by ExtraMail4962 in India a step closer to getting its fifth-generation aircraft: What is this advanced fighter and why we need it? by Gari_305

There are 7 nations that design and produce jet engines + 2 who successfuly reverseengineered and produce stolen designs.

India is in neither of those groups.

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ExtraMail4962 t1_iwd4g2n wrote

Out of the 7 nation only 2 can make engine for next gen Planes.

Russian/chineese jets are very inefficient, have low lifespan and suffer for improper combustion.

French have made good engine but they still not capable of producing 5th gen jets

UK,USA can make good engine due to rolls Royce and P&W

There aren't any other countries capable of making good jet engine

>India is in neither of those groups

I never said india was capable of producing 5th gen jet engine. But india has made its own jet engine which is the Kaveri engine

https://youtu.be/ittfy-LcFvU

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coconut_rambo t1_iwg8c9h wrote

Kaveri engine is still being developed.p The link you provided is a 12 year old video India still imports for LCA.

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ExtraMail4962 t1_iwg8uxe wrote

Kaberi recently completed its test in russia with sucessful core

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coconut_rambo t1_iwg9kws wrote

Where will it be used?

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ExtraMail4962 t1_iwgabvq wrote

Ghatak stealth UCAV

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coconut_rambo t1_iwgarub wrote

So can't reverse engineer ge engine and use it for fighter.

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ExtraMail4962 t1_iwgeijk wrote

India has been making engine for su-30mki and Mirage 2000 for quiet a while. If copying it would be possible it would have been done

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coconut_rambo t1_iwgfhg3 wrote

Really? They are manufacturing these planes with kits provided by Russia and France. Recently the technology transfer may have happened. Can you point out where and when they did this?

https://www.defensenews.com/global/asia-pacific/2022/09/14/industry-exercise-finds-india-underestimated-future-engine-demand/#:~:text=India%20presently%20lacks%20a%20dedicated,produce%20an%20indigenous%20jet%20engine.

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ExtraMail4962 t1_iwgg15k wrote

Hal has been making al-31 engine from scratch for quiet a while

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coconut_rambo t1_iwghudj wrote

Just five years ago with technology transfer from Russia. 2017. Not quite a while Whereas kaveri is 27 years in development.

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coconut_rambo t1_iwgid07 wrote

If it has then ask yourself why are we importing engines for LCA?

There is lot of misinformation in India and the negative news are rarely reported, so people think we're are doing great, but the devil is in the details

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ExtraMail4962 t1_iwgir0p wrote

>If it has then ask yourself why are we importing engines for LCA?

Al-31 would be overkill for Tejas

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coconut_rambo t1_iwgu6ol wrote

Ah got it. We created a better engine in 4 years, but the smaller engine we don't care so we are importing it after failing for 27 years.

This is why east or west India is the best.

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ExtraMail4962 t1_iwgv96j wrote

Al-31 is not a efficient or long lasting engine as it's based of Russia design and that's why it isn't used in anything but su-30mki.

Also al-31 can't fit in tejas or tejas mk2 as it's crazy big and modifing the to get al-31 engine would be same as making a new jet from scratch

Also the ip right to al-31 are still with russia and we can't copy or modify it without their permission

India needs a 130kn class engine which which is going to be declared in partnership with uk or france and will be used on amca.

I suggest u stop talking if u don't know full facts. U are making yourself look dumb

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coconut_rambo t1_iwgw7vm wrote

I have been following this since you were a baby and when you are my age you will get some sense knocked in to you.

India cannot do some things which is why it is partnering. Time is running out and progress is very less. Read the link that I posted. It is a recent assessment of where we are, not some 2017 article.

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ExtraMail4962 t1_iwgwryt wrote

You have been following this for decades but still didn't knew al-31 couldn't be fit into tejas?

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coconut_rambo t1_iwgxzli wrote

Go talk to someone in HAL or IAF. Go find out why India invested in Kaveri?

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ExtraMail4962 t1_iwgygsi wrote

GTRE is responsible for Kaveri not HAL, kaveri was originally made for LCA Tejas but to to delay ti was split for tejas program

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acatnamedrupert t1_iwd8bim wrote

Alright then let me clarify:

There is no such thing as a next gen engine. They are just engines. The F119 and F135 are impressive beasts. But the EJ200 has a thrust to weight in the same range. Snecma M88 is close to it. Thrust vectoring, several non 5th gen planes have such capabilities. Also 5th or 6th gen planes...claimed ones? developed ones? claimed to be developed ones? If we are talking about the latter then shooot we have many of those, even former Yugoslavia claimed to have developed a stealth fighter.

Calling out certain brands also makes little sense since most NATO members and NATO alies are codeveloping engines now a days. EJ200 was British/German/Italian/Spanish companies co-developing it. F136 upgrade to P-W F135 was a G-E/Rolls Royce co-development.

Japan has co-developed with G-E to produce their next engine for their sixt gen fighter. Their current F-2 [a home made F-16 upgrade under licence] uses a home built and upgraded F110.

No idea where China stole it's designs, but they did upgrade them past what they were.

The indian engine has been in a test/research stage for ages and will continue to be in a test research/stage for at least a decade or two.

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ExtraMail4962 t1_iwd9gen wrote

>There is no such thing as a next gen engine.

The , next gen jet engine have stealth feature and also engine with adaptive cycle are under development.

>Also 5th or 6th gen planes...claimed ones? developed ones? claimed to be developed ones? If we are talking about the latter then shooot we have many of those, even former Yugoslavia claimed to have developed a stealth fighter.

I am talking about jet engine not planes

>Calling out certain brands also makes little sense since most NATO members and NATO alies are codeveloping engines now a days. EJ200 was British/German/Italian/Spanish companies co-developing it. F136 upgrade to P-W F135 was a G-E/Rolls Royce co-development.

Most of the development was still done my one of 2 Major countries so it does makes sense

>No idea where China stole it's designs, but they did upgrade them past what they were.

Chinese engine are very similar to Russian ones and they also took the same approach of upscaling engine like Russian which caused it to be very inefficient

>The indian engine has been in a test/research stage for ages and will continue to be in a test research/stage for at least a decade or two.

No, it just completed its test with new core recently in russia and it's dry variant will be uses in the Ghatak UCAV by 2024-2026

And if u just count making engine , then india has been making engine for su-30mki and Mirage 2000 from scratch for quiet a while

Also india is working in co-development with saffran or Rolls-Royce to develop a new 140kn engine

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