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DesiignedTheFuture t1_isa07me wrote

Reply to comment by ChubbyProlapse in Accepted (2021) - A school in Louisiana is celebrated for putting traditionally underserved students into Ivy League colleges, but an investigation uncovers its charismatic founder's controversial methods (CC) [01:22:56] by thesecondfire

I don't get it, how is it for the sake of diversity when they're being made to look like extremely capable students regardless of race?

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__crackers__ t1_isautpf wrote

How long do you think you would be fooled by a below-average student claiming to be an excellent one? Would you honestly need more than five minutes to tell they're full of shit?

It seems unlikely that university admissions would have swallowed all those bullshit applications if they hadn't actively wanted to.

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DesiignedTheFuture t1_isb01oz wrote

Where I live, most people do not go for face to face interviews for university courses. You're admitted on the strength of your personal statement and predicted grades instead which is why I was confused about it being a "diversity" thing.

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baconcheesecakesauce t1_isa8wqo wrote

That's some editorializing on the part of the above poster.

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PartyPorpoise t1_isapurc wrote

The school itself definitely sold itself on being a place that helped young black students succeed. But yeah, I doubt the colleges took race so strongly into account when accepting students. Sure, a lot of colleges want to say they’re diverse, (whether they actually care is another discussion) but a highly accomplished student being black is at best a bonus to them, they’re not going around enrolling under qualified black kids.

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Spackledgoat t1_isavea0 wrote

I’m not sure that view is accurate given the information that has come out regarding the test scores required of individuals of different races to be accepted into top universities.

Here is an article from the Harvard crimson that has a graph of the average SAT scores of admitted students by race: https://www.thecrimson.com/article/2018/10/22/asian-american-admit-sat-scores/

You can find similar information regarding academic qualifications for med school applicants and law school applicants.

For law, bar passage rates provide an interesting data point. Those taking the bar have all graduated law school and are taking the same test (which, from my experience, is far easier than most law school tests). We would expect that if all law school applicants were qualified, they would be able to pass the minimum qualifications test at nearly the same rate. What we see instead is that the first time bar passage rate in 2021 for white takers was 24% higher than black takers (85% vs 61%). The passage rate for black takers was also 9% less than any other group, which may suggest schools are accepting and graduating black students who are less qualified than their peers of other races.

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napsXfactsXsnacks t1_isb3icm wrote

Or it may suggest that white students have greater access to things like bar prep courses, are less financially stressed out and overburdened by work and family expectations and have more time dedicated to prep. That number only proves your hypothesis if you’re unwilling to take any other factors into account.

Edit: it’s also historically accurate to say that the SAT is a test that was literally designed by a eugenicist to prove that white people are smarter than Black people. College admissions look at a wide array of factors and having a high SAT score isn’t the end all be all. Nonblack kids also have the financial advantage of prep courses on that number as well.

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Spackledgoat t1_iscufnp wrote

Yeah, these qualified students who just completed no less then 7 years of post secondary education and hold a professional doctorate are being held back by bar prep availability.

Even if it’s just how prepared the students are, the average first year black law student has a GPA in the bottom 10% of their class. We can pretend that these students just have a tough life (even though, if I recall correctly, a large majority of black law students are from families with incomes in the top half of household incomes in the US and are 3x over represented than the general population for having parents with terminal degrees), or maybe the schools are admitting unqualified students to boost diversity numbers.

There’s a whole “mismatch theory” regarding the negative effects of putting unqualified students into academic environments and the negative effects of doing so. Really fascinating stuff.

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