CJYP t1_ivcguhi wrote on November 6, 2022 at 11:07 PM

Reply to comment by Hyperbowleeeeeeeeeee in Cambridge City Council to consider citywide ban on ‘turning on red’ by superfakesuperfake

I think it's safe because of that study cited in the Wikipedia article I linked. Do you have any counter-evidence?

> People don't expect anyone to jump the light.

I think you missed the key point. You wouldn't jump a stop sign when people are moving, so you don't jump the light in front of people who are moving. If you do, you're not doing an Idaho Stop. You're just being an idiot. The whole point is you only jump the light when there's nobody coming, and therefore nobody to surprise.

Hyperbowleeeeeeeeeee t1_ivcn9xr wrote on November 6, 2022 at 11:53 PM

It seems like we're talking past each other. Drivers don't expect anyone to jump a light because that's illegal. Your perception of the safety of doing so is irrelevant. You don't see every car in every situation, so the expectation of drivers is important to your safety too. In general, drivers rely on the predictability of what's around them because of the inertia of a vehicle. Decisions have to be made in advance to keep everyone alive, and having the expectation that people are following the rules of the road is an important part of making those predictions. If you ever drove, I think this would be pretty intuitive to you.

CJYP t1_ivcomlz wrote on November 7, 2022 at 12:03 AM

You're correct that my perception that an Idaho Stop is safer is irrelevant. However, the linked study showing that it is safer is definitely relevant. I don't understand what you're missing here. The Wikipedia article is right there in my original comment, and the study is cited with a link in that article.

Hyperbowleeeeeeeeeee t1_ivcoxmv wrote on November 7, 2022 at 12:06 AM

It's irrelevant because it isn't legal here. If you're doing it and nobody else knows, then it can't possibly be safer than following the law is.

CJYP t1_ivcq50d wrote on November 7, 2022 at 12:15 AM

I strongly disagree with the idea that whether it is legal or not actually matters. All it changes is whether people do it or not. I doubt most drivers in the states where it is legal actually know about it.

That said, this is conjecture that I don't have direct evidence for. I searched and can't find evidence for or against. So in the interest of not arguing in circles, I'm going to leave it at that and stop replying here.